In dealing with the Covid economic crisis, governments must not repeat the strategy of the last crisis, where the withdrawal of fiscal stimulus adversely impacted growth, the continuation of quantitative easing, and low-interest rates propelled asset prices ever higher. It led to a combination of hi

In dealing with the Covid economic crisis, governments must not repeat the strategy of the last crisis, where the withdrawal of fiscal stimulus adversely impacted growth, the continuation of quantitative easing, and low-interest rates propelled asset prices ever higher. It led to a combination of high inequality, financial fragility, huge amounts of debt, and growing anxiety everywhere.

Paul JayHi, I'm Paul Jay and welcome to theAnalysis.news podcast. Don't forget, if you like thesepodcasts, you could show us by hitting the donate button if you haven't already.

So this is the second part of our interview talking about the United Nations Conference onTrade and Development, that's UNCTAD and its 2020 report titled 'From Global Pandemic toProsperity For All: Avoiding Another Lost Decade'.

Now joining us again from Geneva to discuss the report is its principal author, RichardKozul-Wright. He's the Director of the Division on Globalization and Development Strategiesat UNCTAD. He's also the author of 'Transforming Economies: Making Industrial PolicyWork for Growth, Jobs, and Development'. And if you haven't listened to or watched partone, I suggest you go back to part one because this will make part two make more sense.Thanks for joining us, Richard.

Richard Kozul-WrightGood to be back, Paul.

Paul JayI'm going to just quote a section and then we'll talk about it and then I'll quote anothersection. We'll talk about it.

So in a part which headline is 'Look Back in Anger,' you write, Government, and we're talkingsince the 07/08 crisis, "government spending did increase, but the programs targeted largefirms and financial institutions, not workers, homeowners, and local communities". You'retalking to a large extent about the Fed, although I suppose this applies to some of theEuropean governments as well.

The argument is that people who defend how that money was spent, and I'm not sure weactually know what proportion went essentially to prop up the stock market and the value ofassets and how much actually got into the pockets of ordinary people, but certainly a largepart and maybe the lion's share went towards large firms andfinancial institutions. At any rate, the argument for doing that is that if you didn't do that, thenlarge firms and financial institutions might have collapsed causing a mass amount ofbankruptcy, which would have caused so much economic dislocation, that it would have hurtworkers, homeowners and local communities even more. So what do you make of that?

Richard Kozul-WrightPart of what we're trying to do in this report is to hold up the experience after the globalfinancial crisis as a warning. We're all talking about recovering better or building back better,I think is the slogan in political circles.

Paul JayBiden's slogan.

Richard Kozul-WrightYeah, exactly. People forget that Gordon Brown and Obama and the people whocongregated in London in April 2009, had much the same rhetoric. The plan that theyhatched in London was pretty progressive. They made a promise to put a priority on jobs.They would reregulate finance so that the excesses didn't happen again. They would keeptrade flowing. There'd be a focus on innovation. I mean, a lot of the things that we're hearingnow we're very much up-front and center.

Paul JayThis is when?

Richard Kozul-WrightIn 2009. The G20,