Episode 214-Silence is Golden
Also Available OnPodcast TranscriptGun Lawyer– Episode 214 Transcript

Gun Lawyer — Episode 214 Transcript

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

deregulation movement, silencers legalization, hearing protection, medical endorsement, NFA registration, federal law, New Jersey ban, barrel length, quiet load, gun safety, accidental discharge, groin shot, gun rights, training courses, free speech

SPEAKERS

Evan Nappen, Speaker 3

Evan Nappen 00:19

I’m Evan Nappen, and welcome to Gun Lawyer. Well, I hope you all had a very Happy Trumpsgiving! You know, that’s where we all gave thanks that Kommiela didn’t become President and that both houses of the legislature are controlled by the Republicans. A lot to be thankful for. Yes. As many of you know, it wasn’t just President Trump who dodged a bullet, but America apparently dodged a bullet. So, there’s a lot of good things on the horizon, my friends, and we can be cautiously optimistic.

Evan Nappen 01:00

One of those things I want to talk about today is the movement toward the deregulation and, we’ll use the word loosely, legalization, although that’s kind of loose, of silencers. You see silencer is kind of an old term from the 1930s. They’re really known as suppressors. Today, we don’t really call them silencers, but the law uses the word silencer to define the item that we think of that is, in fact, a muffler for a gun. Now, of course, a silencer itself doesn’t make a gun completely silent. It doesn’t whisper like in the movies. You know, tuh, tuh, tuh. Silencers don’t act that way. They reduce the blast, but there’s still noise being made. A pretty significant noise, but it’s lowered enough that it doesn’t blow your ears out. Imagine that.

Evan Nappen 02:17

It’s something so that you can actually, for example, hunt and have a suppressor. So, when you shoot your gun, you’re not blowing your ears out without hearing protection on or at the range when practicing. By having a suppressor, you can hear range commands and talk to other people and be even safer. It’s all about, essentially hearing protection. And this is where we had a very interesting development that I want to bring to your attention. Because we’re going to see movement on this, and it’s kind of exciting. We’ll see movement on a lot of things. You know, President Trump has promised to, as soon as he gets into office, basically, he’s going to repeal by Executive Order fifty of the senile sock puppets Executive anti-gun rights Orders. They’re all going to go. President Trump has already stated after the election that he’s pushing for National Reciprocity, which we’ve discussed. But there’s a lot of areas where we, as pro-gun rights folks can see change, needed change.

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Evan Nappen 03:41

Silencers or suppressors are definitely one of those areas, and I think an interesting development here has occurred. A major medical group has put out a position paper, a statement, if you will, explaining and stating that silencers, suppressors, protect one’s hearing, and in fact, any of these noise reduction devices are a good thing when it comes to protecting your hearing. Now, the name of the group is the American Academy of Otolaryngology, believe it or not, which is head and neck surgeons, etc. (AAO- HNS) (https://www.entnet.org/resource/suppressors-for-hearing-preservation/) They are eye/ear organizations. Well, it’s all part of what they do. They have approximately 13,000 members.

Evan Nappen 04:53

This group recently put out a statement, which will be very helpful, I believe, in getting legislation passed about the importance of suppressors for hearing preservation. That’s literally what this academy put out in their statement with the heading “Suppressors for Hearing Preservation”. They stated in their statement, if you will, as follows. “Sound suppressors are mechanical devices attached to the barrel of a firearm designed to reduce harmful impulse noise of firearms at its source. CDC research has shown that ‘The only potentially effective noise control method to reduce [shooters’] noise exposure from gunfire is through the use of noise suppressors that can be attached to the end of the gun barrel.'” So, we have the backing of this major group, and they’ve made it clear the medical implications and benefits of silencers and suppressors. This group is headed by Dr. Timothy Wheeler, who put the proposed statement together alongside six of his colleagues. Dr. Wheeler is a Board-Certified Otolaryngologist, and he is also the founder of Doctors For Responsible Gun Ownership. (https://drgo.us/) So, I think this is important medically, and it really gives a great basis for suppressors. It’s absolutely true as to why we should not have silencers regulated to the extreme degree that they are.

Evan Nappen 07:15

Right now, silencers are treated the same as machine guns under Federal law. They’re part of the NFA, the National Firearm Act, and they require a very lengthy and detailed registration and licensing through the Federal Government with a tax stamp. Now, it is true that the Federal Government has sped up the process to some degree. Instead of it taking nine months or a year, it only takes about three months or sometimes even less, because they’ve created an online ability to do this. Now I happen to think that their online NFA registration system is really just a beta testing so that they can have a system in place to go the other direction and require that every firearm be registered, and that they can have a national registration that takes place via computer. I think it’s laying the groundwork for that. But with President Trump taking office and Republicans in control, I think their agenda on that front will be seriously stalled. Nonetheless, it does present that potentiality over their electronic database registration that, yeah, at the moment, it makes it easier, but it’s still a ridiculous pain.

Evan Nappen 08:45

Bills have been proposed, and I think we’re going to see bills proposed to basically treat suppressors and silencers in the same way handguns, rifles, pistols, shotguns are treated. Essentially their purchase should be able to be made on a 4473 or not regulated at all, because it’s just flat out stupid to do that. The ban that took place originally under the National Firearm Act in the ’30s. Well, you know, it was all the Warner Brother movies of the gang violence using assassins with suppressors, you know. Same

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old story of media hype and not being anywhere associated with the truth. And yet the truth is, these are medically very beneficial, and it needs to see reform. I think we’re going to see that, and reports and endorsements by medical groups like this will absolutely go a long way to help.

Evan Nappen 09:54

Now this was first brought to my attention via one of the news aggregate sites that I get. I get about a dozen of them, and this one is “The Reload”. (thereload.com) It’s called The Reload, and this was an article by Stephen Gutowski. “Major Medical Group Endorses Firearms Silencers to Prevent Hearing Loss”. (https://thereload.com/major-medical-group-endorses-firearms-silencers-to-prevent-hearing- loss/) So, check out The Reload and sign up for their weekly newsletter. I get a lot of great information from them, and you can link up and see. We’ll have it on our website as well, so you can read the actual statement.

Evan Nappen 10:25

Now the federal law is one thing when we’re talking about silencers and suppressors. The federal law defines “Firearm Silencer” or “Firearm Muffler” as any device for silencing, muffling or diminishing the report of a portable firearm, including any combination of parts, designed or redesigned, and intended for the use in assembling or fabricating a firearm silencer or firearm muffler, any part intended only for use in such assembly or fabrication. This is where we saw a lot of problems. Because the Chicoms were selling so-called fuel filters that were basically do-it-yourself silencers, and then selling them into the U.S. Then the ATF was setting up people that received them, and all that happy horse shit. Yeah, that’s what we saw. You still have to be very careful about that, but that’s the federal definition, which is different than New Jersey’s definition. You see in New Jersey, silencers are just flat out prohibited. Under federal law, if you follow the NFA, you can acquire a silencer legally. You’ve got to pay the tax and do all the paperwork, but you can get one. In New Jersey, you just can’t get one. Period. There’s no way to lawfully acquire it in New Jersey.

Evan Nappen 11:57

Under N.J.S. 2C:39-1g., a “firearm silencer” means any instrument, attachment, weapon or appliance causing the firing of any gun, revolver, pistol or other firearm, to be silent or intended to lessen or muffle the noise of firing of any gun, revolver, pistol or other firearms. So, New Jersey’s definition, as always, is a ridiculously broad, and it is vague. Appliance? An appliance. What? Is my refrigerator a silencer? I mean, what are they even talking about? Let’s put it this way. If you read this and it says attachment, weapon or appliance for causing the firing of every gun, revolver, put it to be silent or intended to lessen or muffle the noise of the firing of any gun. Well, are my ear muffs an appliance? Because it’s sure as hell their intention to lessen the noise of the firing of a gun, folks. I mean, New Jersey’s law is idiotic. How far and vague and all this hasn’t been tested, but it’s probably susceptible to a Constitutional challenge for vagueness or overbreadth, based on just how undefined the definition of silencer is in New Jersey. I’m afraid it will take a court case to kill it, unless we can get serious political change in New Jersey. But if we can at least get the federal law changed, that will be a statement unto itself. Because by getting the federal law changed and silencers and suppressors no longer demonized, it will go a long way to help us in our fight in New Jersey.

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Evan Nappen 14:05

Now, there are some other interesting items out there that I want to bring your attention. That can function in a way that does lessen the report of a firearm yet are not deemed to be silencers by ATF. And one of these things I can tell you is actually New Jersey legal. So, let me tell you about one that well, given how broad New Jersey’s definition is, they’ll probably try to claim, under New Jersey law, that this isn’t Jersey legal. But we would have quite a fight about it. Apparently the Metro Gun Systems is federally legal. Now, what the Metro Gun Systems does is lessens the report of shotguns, and this is very interesting. I learned of this effect decades ago when I went to a turkey shoot at Central Jersey Rifle and Pistol Club.

Evan Nappen 15:21

At the turkey shoot, the idea was to bring your shotgun and whoever got the most pellets in the target, won the turkey. So, this one guy, a member of the club, shows up, and he’s got a break open shotgun called Old Tom, which was kind of hilarious. I think he had stopped along the way in New York where Numrich Arms used to be, and they had an old Tom shotgun. It’s the old top breaker, like the H&R (Harrington and Richardson) Topper-style kind of gun, right? And they had extra barrels for these guns. They were like, five bucks a barrel. It’s an inexpensive gun anyway, and he probably spent 30 bucks on the gun in those days. And what he did was he bought two or three of the extra barrels and then proceeded to machine and weld one barrel onto the other barrel. So, when he showed up at the gun range for the turkey shoot, he had a shotgun with what was essentially, it was about a seven or eight foot barrel on it, which is kind of hilarious. It was really funny. I mean, you go to a turkey shoot and a guy shows up with a shotgun with a seven foot barrel where, basically he can put the muzzle against the target and just pull the trigger, you’re going to get a lot of pellets on that target, right? So, it was pretty funny. But the thing that was amazing is that he actually shot it, and when he shot this gun with a full 12 gage load, all you heard was thump, thump. It was quieter than a car door shutting. This is a 12 gauge, my friends, and it was barely audible. Like bump, bump. No recoil. And what I learned from that is the barrel length itself can create a lessening of the noise of a firearm. The longer barrel allows the gases not to escape out the muzzle in the same way as a shorter barrel would, where it creates the “bang!” out the muzzle, and the longer barrel, it’s for that dissipation of the muzzle gases.

Evan Nappen 17:53

This principle is apparently what’s used by Metro Gun Systems. It is essentially, to boil it down, a three foot shotgun barrel extension that screws into your shotgun choke, thereby giving your shotgun almost a six-foot barrel. And guess what? You get the long Tom effect with that. Metro systems. You can Google them. You can find them. It’s Metro Gun Systems. (metrogun.com) They have a Q and A, and it says, is the Metro Gun System legal? It says yes. The U.S. Government Agency, USDA, uses the Metro Gun System for nuisance pest control, as do several other agencies. This gun system has been cleared by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, and is not considered to be a silencer. Now, I don’t have that in writing from ATF, but that is what’s on Metro Gun Systems page, and they’ve been around for a while.

Evan Nappen 18:51

Now, this Metro Gun Systems barrel attachment might still be a problem, arguably, in New Jersey under their definition, but I’ll tell you what isn’t a problem in New Jersey. A gun that has from its original

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manufacturer, a long barrel. If you can get a .22 that has a long barrel, and I mean at least 28 inches, even 29 or 30s. They’re out there. Like the old single shot Winchesters, single shot Remingtons. The CZ Ultra Lux, I think, has a 29 they made. Norinco made copies of the 98K German rifles at a 30 inch barrels for .22s. If you get any of those long barrels .22s, then you buy a box of quiet loads. Those will recall the quiet load. It’s made by CCI. It’s a .22 bullet that specifically has a power load made to be quieter, less noise in its report. If you put a quiet load in a long barrel .22 like that, it is virtually silent. I mean, basically, all you hear is the lead hitting the target. It’s that quiet. And that is Jersey legal, because that’s just a long barrel .22. Nothing attached to it. It’s a long barrel .22, and with the quiet load which is a legal .22 round, you’ve got yourself a Jersey-legal, suppressed equivalent in a .22. But let’s hope we can get these laws changed so we can protect our hearing.

Evan Nappen 20:50

Speaking of which, the WeShoot range in Lakewood has some pretty cool stuff coming up that I want to tell you about. WeShoot is a great indoor range in Lakewood, New Jersey. It’s where I shoot, my brother shoots, my son shoots, my family shoots. And they have some cool stuff. They also have some great training classes coming up that I want to bring your attention. They’re offering the New Jersey concealed carry, the CCARE course. They’re offering a number of courses for carry. They’re offering USCCA NJ carry courses on Tuesday, December 3; Friday, December 13; Sunday, December 22; and Monday, December 30. They’re also offering the NRA New Jersey carry course on Friday, December 6. They’re offering CCARE certification renewals and all kinds of training. Just go to their website. Go to weshootusa.com, and you can see all the great training courses. You can get your CCARE, your other training so you can get your New Jersey carry.

Evan Nappen 22:13

They’re also offering Utah carry, and you can get your Utah non-resident CCW. Then you can add on Florida, Virginia and Arizona. Then all those carries are going to give even broader carries, because those licenses cover a multitude of other states. You can really expand your ability to carry beyond even the U.S. states and jurisdictions that have Constitutional carry where there’s no permit required at all. So, if you want to carry and you travel, you can take advantage of these great offerings at WeShoot. They’re even offering a New York City non-resident carry course so you can carry in New York City, New York State. They offer that, too.

Evan Nappen 23:09

They’re also offering something else that’s very interesting. It’s not just guns at WeShoot. They know the way we think. We all like to be prepared. You know, we like to be ready for an emergency. That’s one of the reasons we own guns, right? Just in case. They’re offering what’s called HamCram Radio. That’s right. You can obtain your amateur radio license in just one day. They’re offering that course so you can have the power of global communication and get your ham license right from them. So, check it out. They also have courses for new shooters, and they’ve got all kinds of weekend courses. Check out, we shoot for all your training needs. It’s just a great range. You’ll love to shoot there. weshootusa.com.

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Evan Nappen 24:10

Additionally, please make sure that you are a member of the Association of New Jersey Rifle & Pistol Clubs. They are the premier gun rights group in New Jersey. They’re the folks fighting in the courts and in the legislature for our gun rights. They are really incredibly important to maintaining our Second Amendment rights in New Jersey. And you know, the gun rights oppressors have got a number of things up their sleeve, and in future shows, I’ll be discussing in detail the insane threats that they’re pushing. You won’t believe it, folks. We need our state Association more than ever with you as a member to fight these shenanigans. We are on the right side, but unless we unite, we cannot win. So, please join the Association. Go to anjrpc.org, anjrpc.org and join today. You’ll get many benefits, including critical email alerts, and the actual newsletter on New Jersey gun rights, which is the best in the state. You’ll know that you are part of the solution.

Evan Nappen 25:41

Let me also take a moment to shamelessly plug my book, New Jersey Gun Law, the Bible of New Jersey gun law. It is your guidebook to understanding the insane matrix so that you don’t become a GOFU in New Jersey. Please get the book. It’s 120 topics, all in a question and answer format. I wrote it for you. I wrote it based on my over 35 years’ experience. It’s the 25th Anniversary Edition. It will help save your ass, no joke. I get folks all the time thanking me for the book, and it makes me very happy that they appreciate it, because it’s a labor of love. You can buy your copy at EvanNappen.com. That’s my personal website for the law office. EvanNappen.com. You will find a nice link there to the Big Orange Book. Get your copy. It also makes a great gift for the holidays, and I know that you will love it. As a matter of fact, it has literally saved people from getting arrested because they had it with them in the car while the officer is actually being shown the law in my book. No joke. I mean, this is just the craziness that happens in New Jersey. So go to EvanNappen.com and get a copy today.

Evan Nappen 27:24

Hey, let’s take a look here. I have a letter. I love my Ask Evan letters. This is from Steven. Steven says, Evan, I was told that if you took the new qualification test within the last two years that you didn’t need to requalify to renew. I’m due to renew by April 25 for my carry. Can you confirm this is true? I took the initial qualification, and then took the additional one a year later, after I got my permit, as the rule solidified. So, it’s been within the last two years.

Evan Nappen 27:55

Steven, the law that you need to know says that, in fact, you are covered. And I’m going to give you the law right now. So, if anyone wants to challenge you on it, you’ll be able to say, here’s the actual statute. And what you do is you go to N.J.S. 2C:58-4, subsection d.(3). There’ll be a link on our website to this statute. And what it says is that the requirement for classroom instruction and target training shall not be required for a renewal applicant who completed the instruction and training when obtaining a permit to carry a handgun issued within the previous two years. So, the law on that is right there. If you’re within two years, Steven, you’re good to go. So, that’s your black letter law answer to that question.

Evan Nappen 29:18

You know I was thinking about why. Why do I even do Gun Lawyer? Well, I love educating. I love helping all my brothers and sisters in arms, and I really want to keep everybody from becoming victims

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of New Jersey’s anti-gun rights laws from the gun rights oppressors. These are all things that I believe in. I’ve dedicated my life to it. But, you know, I had a lot of issues with fascist book, what some people call Facebook. I call fascist book, and many of you may be familiar with that. You know, I think I earned every fascist book jail badge you could get. And I got to a point where, you know, I could not express myself because they restrict freedom of speech.

Evan Nappen 30:12

Just recently, get a load of this, Smith and Wesson got kicked off Facebook. Smith and Wesson. What do you think Smith and Wesson was talking about on Facebook? One guess, yeah, right. Guns. I mean, come on. The rules are so contorted that they got kicked off Facebook. And not only did Smith and Wesson get knocked off, but do you know who else had the same problem? Daisy BB guns. Man, Daisy BB guns. I mean, it’s insanity out there. This is a gun rights oppression via our First Amendment oppression. That’s what they’re doing. Oppressing First Amendment rights and Second Amendment rights combined. I really can’t stand fascist book.

Evan Nappen 31:04

Yet, one of the greatest things, of course, is one of our heroes, Elon Musk, who purchased Twitter, freed up the platform, and is dedicated to free speech. It is now called X. And guess what? Smith and Wesson specifically thanked X for allowing them to have free speech on that platform. You, too, can have free speech on that way better platform. You know, this is sad, but I think we’re going to have to see more and more change to the restriction that the oppressors like to do. They don’t want our message out there, and it’s really one of the reasons for this podcast. I was getting sick of being algorithmed to death, shadow banned, you know, Facebook jail, and all that crap. So, this became the forum. Now you see even companies like Daisy and Smith & Wesson being knocked out of fascist book.

Evan Nappen 32:16

So, what about this week’s GOFU? Well, a GOFU is that Gun Owner Fuck Up. It’s where somebody makes a very serious, problematic mistake that costs them dearly, and you get to learn for free. Now, this one isn’t about a specific incident, but it’s something that I’ve seen a lot way more than I’d prefer to see. Now, we’ve talked about accidental discharges. Well, I mean, just last week, I had three ADs come through the office, folks. Three ADs. And I’m just always saddened by it. But yet, what happens with an AD is they end up trying to take your guns, take your license, and even conceivably criminally charging you, even though it was an accident. Can you imagine that of every car accident? If anytime you had a car accident, you got criminally charged and your license was taken away for any car accident, no matter what. Well, that’s how they view gun accidents, though, and an accident is an accident.

Evan Nappen 33:27

You have to really be careful and always keep that very conscientious awake and make sure you know your gun, the trigger, the placement, especially when holstering and re-holstering. But the GOFU I want to particularly talk about today, even drilling down a little deeper on accidental discharges, is shooting yourself in the groin. So, it’s not just an AD, but an AD that becomes a groin shot. So, how does this happen? Well, recently, a fella put his gun in his pants without a holster and that’s asking for trouble.

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You’re asking for trouble because if your shirt gets stuck under the trigger and you do that wonderful appendix carry and boom, you shoot your balls off. So, this week’s GOFU is not to shoot your balls off.

Evan Nappen 34:35

And if you think that this is uncommon, I tell you what. Just Google “man shoots self in groin” and look how many stories come up of people shooting themselves in the groin. I mean, I just did, and it says here. Police said the man shot twice at his girlfriend’s ex and missed. He put the gun away in his pants, and it discharged shooting him in his groin. Man shoots groin while trespassing. He went to an elementary school and boom, shot himself in the groin. A Florida man accidentally shot himself the groin when he sat down on his gun. Man is recovering from his self-inflicted gun into the groin after a bizarre shooting outside his apartment. Man accidentally shoots himself while putting his gun in his shorts, and he died after shooting himself in the groin. It goes on and on. Groin shooting. That is probably the worst GOFU. It’s way up there, ain’t it, folks.

Evan Nappen 35:42

And I’ll tell you what? I know of a case where a guy had a .410 Derringer, one of the old Cobra Derringers. They were a double barrel, .410, made by Cobra Enterprise. The old model didn’t have a safety, but the new model did. This guy puts a loaded Cobra into the front of his pants. It didn’t have a safety, and this thing went off. I saw the pictures of what his groin looked like. It looked like a really bad spaghetti and meatballs dinner is what it looked like. Okay, folks? So, this week’s GOFU is really simple. Try not to shoot yourself in the balls.

Evan Nappen 36:32

This is Evan Nappen reminding you that gun laws don’t protect honest citizens from criminals. They protect criminals from honest citizens.

Speaker 3 36:42

Gun Lawyer is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Reach us by emailing Evan@gun.lawyer. The information and opinions in this broadcast do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state.

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Downloadable PDF TranscriptGun Lawyer S3 E214_Transcript
About The HostEvan Nappen, Esq.

Known as “America’s Gun Lawyer,” Evan Nappen is above all a tireless defender of justice. Author of eight bestselling books and countless articles on firearms, knives, and weapons history and the law, a certified Firearms Instructor, and avid weapons collector and historian with a vast collection that spans almost five decades — it’s no wonder he’s become the trusted, go-to expert for local, industry and national media outlets.

Regularly called on by radio, television and online news media for his commentary and expertise on breaking news Evan has appeared countless shows including Fox News – Judge Jeanine, CNN – Lou Dobbs, Court TV, Real Talk on WOR, It’s Your Call with Lyn Doyle, Tom Gresham’s Gun Talk, and Cam & Company/NRA News.

As a creative arts consultant, he also lends his weapons law and historical expertise to an elite, discerning cadre of movie and television producers and directors, and novelists.

He also provides expert testimony and consultations for defense attorneys across America.

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