Episode 125
Growth, Change & Disruption with Brandon Burns

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https://youtu.be/jIW6x85Xi0M

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Description

In this episode, Chris Burns brings Brandon Burns back to the show! As our new Executive Director, Brandon brings back his logical and philosophical background to talk about the current state of our industry, problems facing treatment centers, and efficacious plans to prioritize client care above all else. From maladaptive behaviors to plant-based medicine and disrupting the industry, this team of Burns lays out an information-filled and education-focused episode for all to enjoy.

Talking Points

1. 
   
2. Reintroduction to Brandon Burns (0:28)
   
3. Brandon’s recent journey (2:05)
   
4. Operating from fear (7:11)
   
5. Changes in the industry (9:40)
   
6. Plant-based medicine (11:13)
   
7. Disrupting the industry (15:10)
   
8. Levels of care (21:38)
   
9. Impacts of screen time and social media (22:55)
   
10. The future of Peaks Recovery Centers (27:51)
    
11. Final thoughts (31:56)
    

Quotes

“Fear is such an easy place to operate from, because it’s soothing, in a way, to state I know my truth, and its indifferent to the reality that I’m being faced with. But, for the viewers, the impediment to action advances action. What stands in the way becomes the way”

-Brandon Burns, Executive Director

Episode Transcripts

Episode -125- Transcripts

[Music] hey everybody and welcome to another amazing episode of Finding Peaks your host Yours Truly Chris Burns president and CEO of Peaks recovery centers so grateful to be here today and even more grateful to be joined by my brother business partner and colleague Brandon Burns so grateful to have you on the show today Brandon and welcome back thanks Chris I appreciate it and all the viewers out there I think we have 870,000 followers at this point so for all of those of you have missed me in my episodes it’s uh it’s a wonderful opportunity not only to be back at Peaks but to be back in front of the viewers talking more about our industry and Leadership Behavioral Healthcare and so forth so thanks for having me back Chris absolutely really excited to get into this episode but I wanted to start with kind of a personal tone and lean into this a bit back in 2020 or the end of 2019 I was walking through a season of life that really required me um to get some support for my mental health um I had gone through and worked in the industry for nearly 10 years um we had done a lot and something that I hadn’t done in that process was find it necessary to take great not good but great care of myself and you afforded me this opportunity back in 2020 having been the CEO and you allowed me to go um have this time to really take great care of myself and I’m able to come back today and let the viewers know and you like I’m back better than ever and I’m really really grateful for that um in the opportunity that you had last summer um we were going through a lot as a culture the industry was shifting we got thrown a tremendous amount of curveballs we had some grief that we walked through and so I know that it was it was intense and it felt very disconnected but you had this opportunity as well to take a little break to zoom out a little bit to be where your feet are and uh it’s been my experience since bringing you back into the organization that you experienced a tremendous amount of growth not just personally but professionally and I just wanted to allow the viewers to gain a little bit of insight into that process that you walk through and what you gained from that what you’re bringing back to Peaks rebound tour 2024 yeah I I appreciate it so much Chris and and personally just filled with gratitude to be in this chair today and to be where we are at at Peaks recovery Cent given all of that we’ve gone through as the challenges you know to the viewers out there who remember my episodes and certainly to you know be honest and transparent about it as you know sort of a process just a little bit of a backfill on a storyline uh you know when Chris stepped aside and allowed me to uh become the CEO and high highlight me for that role we had at that time only success at Peaks recovery centers as far as a business you know driven model is going and I was able to ride a really important wave out of covid recreation of services uh getting us away from some of the challenges that we experienced uh in the early settings of covid and it’s really when I reflect on it as a period it’s amazing to ride things up from a business sense of things uh in Behavioral Healthcare any industry or otherwise it’s one thing to be met with extraordinary challenges that you didn’t see coming in this regard and so we won’t speak to the administrative challenges that we experience but you know January 17th of 2023 is sort of a day that will live in infamy with me as far as receiving an administrative problem that I didn’t know how to handle I didn’t know how to handle it emotionally I didn’t know how to go to a team I’ve only had successes with and say we have challenges and this is what we need to do in honesty I just didn’t know how to show up as a leader in that moment and that’s a challenging recognition going through something that was so valuable at the time to be the CEO of an organization and to be its sort of visionary for that time period to hit such a speed bump and a curveball in the road that completely dejected me from the not only the path we were on but the experience of leadership and what do I do now and for the viewers out there I can only describe the process and experience of dejection as uh sort of floundering not having confidence not knowing how to take the next steps and only knowing how to point at a problem rather than create Solutions out of it and I think you other leaders in the organization at the time saw a distress leader in that regard and out of that admittedly upon reflection and it’s not just to scratch backs here like like I needed to take a step away and a step away from I was not in a position to lead and guide in the way that I thought I could throughout that time period And so taking 10 months away from something you know you have a c the CEO title now I have an executive director title I think that’s one experience that was you know really challenging to feel like in a resume way I’m taking a step back and what I’m sharing with the viewers out there is like the emotional response of like anger and uh frustration and moving through processes outside of Peaks but the gifts it gave me was internal of what was my responsibility in this I wish I could have taken that administrative burden away from the company just taken that administrative charge and said this is what we are doing in confidence I got everybody’s back and this is how we’re going to carry this out and it’s through the process of stepping back going on my runs sematic experiences and returning back to the fold that I had a lot of responsibility in that moment and I did let the organization down and I did from a leadership standpoint not have the emotional intellectual and sort of spiritual capacity to move the company through that challenging time and I think it’s important from that standpoint to reflect on the fact ultimately that um we can take these moments and only move into emotional frustration and anger and whatever and things were taken from me or as I was able to do in my process process through my experiences take a step back hone in on my responsibility find a path to show up better in the future and get right sized with my value system so that in the future if I’m in a position executive director CEO or otherwise um that I can meet those challenges uh in real time and um and meet it with a bigger heart and open mind and have the emotional capacity to uh be still in those moments yeah man I really appreciate you not just sharing that with me but with the viewers I think it’s it’s transparent it’s authentic and it’s clear and I know there had been some Rumblings in community on like what had happened and so I just wanted to start off the show with really clearing that up for the viewers is that the opportunity we have today because of what we’ve walked through over the last 10 years as business partners is um and I’ve heard it heard it this morning I’ve heard the slingshot analogy but this morning it was an arrow Karen was telling me about and that’s what I like in your experience over that 10 months to be as much as it felt like this big step back you were really anchoring into a position that you had never been so you could go to a spot um that was foreign and we’re experiencing that today as a company culture and just appreciate again your authenticity and transparency for the yeah and I just want to you know in addition to that honor like fear is such an easy place to operate from um because it’s soothing in a way to State I know my truth and it’s indifferent to the reality that’s in you know that’s that I’m being faced with but you know for the viewers out out there as somebody who sort of transcended that fear through you know philosophy that I’ve shared in the past and I love and through that sort of stoic lens my attitude now in my emotional state is very much of a Marcus aelius tone that the impediment to action advances action and what stands in the way becomes the way and we are to be a rock in the sea of dysfunction in that regard As Leaders within organizational sets so when challenging things happen people can look to us in confidence that we know the path and can be still in those moments and so Stillness is really the principle of I’ve arrived at the tradeoff of fear into Stillness and now the things that are happening are just things we have to move through and there’s no reason to be in fear about it because there is another side to it yeah it’s it’s it’s so clear to me and huge to your point is like presence affords us so much but what informs presence right mental health opportunities to be where I’m at being seen valued and heard in community a lot of the stuff that you expressed that you walked through over the last 10 months it was extraordinarily difficult for us to come to that decision last summer because as I’ve let all the viewers know I mean Brandon Burns is not satiated with the research the Insight the education he continually educates himself so he’s our only industry expert and so it was really difficult to draw that Arrow back and see Brandon go um and having said that we are so grateful to have him back we’re pointed in just a really really cool Direction that’s sustainable and fruit F and intended for the future and we’re really excited to having back and and and really carry out this Mission and this Vision that you created with the team in the first place so um again just really passionate about the opportunity we have in front of us what are some of the things that you saw because a lot of changes in this field really on a day-to-day basis a monthly basis but certainly over a year what are some of the shifts you’ve seen because something that you did even though you took time away was you stayed AB breast to Industry information new things that were coming up Law changes um Behavioral Health Administration you were attuned to all of that throughout the process so what are some of the changes that the viewers can be expecting and to be looking out for as they’re trying to find a great program for their loved one yeah being on the outside kind of looking in and and not knowing exactly what the future would hold for me in that regard it led to opportunities to interview with other companies and programs that led for opportunities for connection um the power of LinkedIn at the end of the day to negotiate with people and create you know professional relationships and I think overall as an industry the industry faces a lot of the same challenges when I left it those challenges I think is the uh saturation of services in certain areas that applies pressure to how we hire individuals professionals within the community and so forth and I think these are some of the great challenges and pitfalls of the future that if this epidemic continues to rise in the background we are falling short of Staff in that regard so maybe one thing the viewers can be mindful of in the future just as they look for you know a valuable program moving forward is lure opportunities you know group sizes within state standards and a variety of these more what feels right professionally things that should exist within companies like this to deliver the best care possible ensuring individual sessions and followup uh complete utilization reviews to ensure that you know your loved ones getting is care in programming is being maximized uh in that regard but we are running into headwinds from a staffing standpoint as an industry and I think that’s something mindful for people to be of when they call Admissions team your website looks beautiful but can you actually deliver this care uh in that way I think you know as we spoke about in the past from these episodes the natural medicine Health act has afforded um the Psychedelic opportunities through uh mushrooms and future opportunities through MDMA and so forth with these U mushrooms being the first sort of uh front lines of the Psychedelic interventions I think we are getting a little over our ski tips here in the state of Colorado and the thing that I’ve referred to the world as um in the professional lens is that I’ve seen a lot of clinicians turn Shaman uh overnight and I’m seeing really an inappropriate I want to call it at some level clinical intervention of what we call heroic doses of psychedelics uh being given to participants and I just think that’s not the direction this was intended to go in and so we’re sort of still in that unregulated sort of wild west space my hope is that by 2025 when uh Healing Center lures actually come out we can get more right sized as a as a state and a world around psychedelic treatment and move away from hero dois into what is more clinically efficacious because really anything as we’ve talked about over two grams is probably um not clinically efficacious uh so I think that’s one thing for the viewers to be thinking about as we move into Healing Centers what does it mean to do a heroicos and why are we doing that at all uh in that regard and then I would say you know kind of the tail into this I think we still have to get our trauma narratives right as an industry and this will be the final note I’ll put on it hear me clearly viewers out there with PTSD diagnosis and individuals who come from traumatic backgrounds um we are right siiz to talk about our trauma and to live in that reality at the same time I think the narrative has gotten away from something that has happened to us in the past a traumatic event as the thing that needs Excavating versus my response maladaptively speaking to the event and my behavior that’s taking to place that’s where trauma lies is in the now and in the behavior not in the past moment uh in that regard and I think the industry could do a better job at relating this to individuals post-traumatic stress disorder means the stress is still happening in front of the past event right so the language matters here and I think if we hone in on that a little bit better uh we can be better informed Trauma Centers at the end of the day yeah I love that’s very good B mte of you you know and and I love that back to your initial point I think it’s important and you brought up a great point for the viewers but what’s happening in our industry as payer sources are beginning to Crunch what programs are doing is they have amazing websites and all of this stuff but they’re they’re Maxim in group sizes over and above um what is the parameter for the state regulations and so one of the questions we really want to encourage people to ask and in addition to a multitude of questions when you’re calling these places like how many group sizes what does individuals look like just get really curious with it because a lot of providers especially in network are moving to this more robust group size to make sense of the lower payments and so I really appreciate you bringing that up and that’s something even as we’re going into a full- end network provider um we are very integrous with as insurance that that group site doesn’t go over 12 because naturally I’m not going to be able to heal in a group setting or have the connectivity I need in the Insight offered if it’s 25 people and again it’s not safe and so I really appreciate you bringing that up for the viewers I think it’s important to move into kind of one of our core values with that is like we’re disrupting the industry through quality of care differently than when we came up with that core value probably three four years ago I know it meant something then and I think it means something quite a bit different today how do we begin to inform that and not spin our wheels and waste time be very intentional with disrupting the industry how do we do that today I think we live in this world unfortunately where the patient wants to say Peaks Recovery Center is letting me down and we want to say no the insurance company and reimbursements are letting us down and then the patient calls the insurance company and says no it’s Peaks and we get into this finger pointing game as an industry at the end of the day and I think that’s disruptive um because all three of these prongs are really needed at the end of the day to drive a successful uh Behavioral Health Care system so for me I think quality of care is a calling to the behavioral health industry to stop acting outside of healthcare to stop creating programmatic features that are based in how we got well at the end of the day to stop driving psychedelic inter ventions that worked for us but might not work for the individual in front of us and to accept the fact that these are time limited interventions you know we’ve talked about it on these past episodes but you know just to recapitulate recapitulate it today the 30-day Paradigm came out of a state law in the Northeast that said individuals who are suffering from alcoholism in the 70s need more time than six days in treatment it’s obvious to us that they need more time and treatment but the challenge is when we say something like we’ll give you 90 days of care is that right size for the individual are they in care for too long do they need to be in residential programming do they need to be in PHP or IOP and these are some of the navigating features of our industry that uh continues to strain something from an outcome basis we work with Vista research Vista research continues to highlight since 1993 the outcomes and the national averages have not changed above 36% as an industry standard and I think that strain and delay and outcomes is not because we aren’t interested in evidence-based practices cognitive behavioral therapy um uh EMDR these types of interventions I think it’s because we continue to place our own philosophies as individuals in recovery whether for mental health or substance use disorders in front of patient care to say I did it this way so you’re going to succeed doing this way but what we’ve learned is that way works 36% of the time and 64% of people need multiple if not tens of dozens of treatment episodes you know to get well in the process and so some way we have to work together within the model that we are in as a Health Care system use variable length to stay as an actual fundamental feature of this and get right sized with what we can work on within a residential treatment model what I mean by that is probably not deep Excavating of traumatic events but stabilization of emotions relationships those types of things and then better utilize these uh buckets of care that we call ambulatory PHP and IOP more usefully once the individual stabilized now we can work on sort of more of these intensives without exacerbating the original symptomology that brought them into care yeah no I think that’s really huge and it’s clear to me it it almost feels like individualized treatment for the first time ever yeah you know it’s like everybody said we’re going to do these things but a lot of times we’re coming in we’re like everybody does grief and loss everybody does identity and purpose everybody does relationship well what if just what if if the individuals coming in need skill building what if they need a community wrapped around them what if we met everybody as an individual and approached their treatment in that way I know we’ve been using a hot kind of coin topic words you know these days and individualized care but really what happens is you come in and you do the program that they’re telling you to do so I love this opportunity because it’s an opportunity to get a little bit more Curious and a little bit more clear with the individual to say hey we don’t need to go down into the line done if we don’t need to we can focus in on what the trauma is causing it’s not about the trauma it’s what happens inside of us and uh outside of us as a result of that trauma so I really love this new way is to say you’re not going to come in we’re going to put a box over your head and say you’re doing this thing really begin to meet people where they’re at and that’s a cuttingedge way I think to disrupt the industry through quality of care yeah thank you and I know as you know about me I love tangents in the past few years so I don’t mean to be tangential about this in any way but I think when you think about the delivery of care and access to care and Behavioral Health Care the vast majority of Clinical Services the better stated the vast majority of clinical interventions are received in a group atmosphere so go around the group and you have individuals suffering from suicidal ideation low ADLs and maybe psychotic features you know in relationship to their medications uh go through the group and you might have somebody who just has a significant opio IDU disorder or a poly substance disorder go around the room and you might have somebody with a major depressive disorder with some use but not you know uh you know not substance use disorder related in that regard so just taking these three individuals that I’ve have described and put them in a room how does rhetorically I’m going to ask the viewers how does a single programmatic approach lower the symptomology and advanced recovery for each individual within that setting never mind in the state of Colorado the behavioral health administration the group size is not greater than 12 so just put 12 people inside that group at the end of the day how does a program atic intervention speak to the symptomology of each individual it’s rhetorical because it is nearly impossible when we ask it in that framework so from a group perspective we need to be more creative in our approaches to that and more honest with family systems about the maximum possibility of delivering interventions in time limited Services uh at the end of the day I believe I had a follow-up point to the group sitting at the end of the day but maybe I can just rest it there and it’ll come up here in the future well I love that too because it it really points to this piece of a greater process right and you you pointed to length of stay and and not excluding these really valuable intensives that have been around for a while that we know we can extrapolate really good information from and growth it’s just doing them at the right time and at the right size which is something we haven’t really looked at in this industry is this person ready to receive this service is it going to exacerbate symptoms fine then we’re not doing it and so I think it paints a very clear picture for people coming into care that we are potentially moving into something that Peaks recovery that could treat each person as an individual and begin to back up what we talk about a lot which is treating suffering yeah absolutely and what if family systems knew the correct language at the end of the day for how this is working it’s not a program it’s called levels of care it’s residential PHP IOP outpatient that’s how it works what is it based in it’s based in Asam ter you know criteria what do those standards mean what does the behavioral health administration here in Colorado mean all of these external bodies are applying pressure to these models at the end of the day and so when I think about that original sort of cycle between provider uh manag Care Systems and patients at the end of the day all of these things are applying at one time and so removing the hyperbolic language as an opportunity and informing family systems how this actually works I think would be actually very healing for the family system coming in to know why Johnny just got stepped down to this thing called PHP when you said it could could be for 30 days at the same time because that’s the expectation of the Managed Care Systems and I think it would provide a lot more insights to the individual who’s moving through care about what I need to be working on and to not sort of get uh comfortable about this position that I’m in because somebody told me I was guaranteed you know these time frames and I guess the last thing I’ll add to it you know one of the one of the thing that strikes me kind of is absurd in our industry from a quality standpoint right now is like we know these cell phone devices we know social media at the end the day is messing with our brains there’s not a person you can walk to In This World right now I think that’s paying any attention to this that this isn’t causing a lot of harm especially to adolescents to adults from our attention and consumption standpoint so an ad that says something like come into programming get your cell phone here today one yeah cell phones matter in this world like we need them at another Point like these are behavioral health disorders and at the strictest level these things are m ING with that disorder at the end of the day and exacerbating the issue so I want to be curious with the industry why cell phones at the end of the day are so important when we know it’s causing a lot of these issues at the end of the day for the individual that’s suffering and to just be mindful that as a family system is it more important to have your cell phone in treatment or is it more important to get down to the disorder and get into Solutions and move into recovery and so it’s not that cell phones are bad in treatment it’s if there’s an ad about that we should probably put our Spidey senses on and go maybe this isn’t where I want my loved one to go yeah yeah I think I was reading something the other day in regards to cell phones um with respect to its ability to detract from our mental health increase anxiety exacerbate depression because there’s this thing that we don’t get a lot in our culture anymore that we used to have as kids it’s called boredom yeah and this boredom thing actually Fosters a lot um thought deep thinking Insight presence presence empathy so these things come up and then at worst case you go outside yeah and so we’re we’re missing a lot of that and I’m grateful that you brought that up because tremendous amount of information on and how this detracts from our mental health yet we see programs putting them on their website and saying you can have these come on in so something to be we of and mindful of of the program structure when you’re going in you know are they there to make a book are they there to find Healing For The Individual because the power of know is really powerful MH you know yeah and I would imagine for a lot of people coming in and we can just put a pin in it to continue the episode forward um for the car drives home but an individual coming into treatment that’s demanding their cell phone is probably likely exceeding six hours of screen time on their phone at the end of the day I mean when we think about that from a day standpoint that’s in my quick Mass there I think that’s 25% of our day staring at at a screen at the end of the day this cannot be part of the solution in that way or part of the thing that uh we need to get well in the end of the day I think for all viewers out there and any patient or client experience who know that you can’t take my cell phone it’s not about taking your cell phone it’s I’m confident that if you put this thing down for 30 days and work on yourself you will see the value of putting this thing down for that time period and just encouraging you the viewers to take that seriously for your mental well being yeah in the 15 years that I’ve been doing this there hasn’t been a single person that’s relinquished their cell phone for 30 or 45 treatments to day that when they got it back didn’t say they were grateful for that opportunity not a single person yeah so it is again we’re back to the arrow y pull it back to launch over a potential spot we’ve ever been so really appreciate that I want to end with you know we’re coming up on we’ve talked about how we can continue to inform the industry through quality of care we’ve talked about some changes we would make we talked about some changes that have happened um some new rules and regulations Peaks recovery is rolling into a very special anniversary um our 10year anniversary and I remember when we we opened Peaks recovery in 2014 um something that was really important to me I wasn’t right sized at the time but I was like man somehow someway Someday my brothers are going to be out here and we’re going to be rocking this thing and so here we are 10 years removed from that day we got Dylan who’s over in it we got you is in the executive director of role and to be very clear and Frank with the viewers you you and I are are very relational for the first time in a long time and it it it feels really good feels like we have a phenomenal and integrous opportunity to move the company in a direction that we’ve never been and I’m really really grateful about that opportunity but I wanted to talk with you a little bit about some of the gratitudes you have I mean 10 years is a long time um to your point and certainly a point that I’ve connected with uh we’ve been able to build somewhat of a resilient company we’ve gone through a [ __ ] ton of stuff a bunch of curveballs in the last two years that have otherwise sunk a normal small mom and pop business and so as we roll into this 10e the anniversaries in September were as connected as ever dyan’s on site our ownership group is coming together what are some of the stuff that you’re excited about in this uh this anniversary season yeah thank you for that the uh I you know maybe as a joke maybe it’s not a joke maybe it’s not funny but it feels like we’re on our nights live like we we’ve put a lot of I think one of the gifts of Entrepreneurship it comes with a lot of fear in the beginning of it we don’t have the spirituality coming into this no doubt I didn’t even know what a PHP was when I started here you know at Peaks at the end of the day one of the gifts of being an entrepreneur is you get realtime life lessons along the way as a professional not just in behavioral health care but a person who’s come to recognize the values in running a business and something like Behavioral Health is there are clinicians and doctors who come in with all of this intrinsic motivation to treat the patient that’s in front of them and I got a big heart and love for the patients I walk by high five in every day at Peaks recovery centers but what this time frame has given me is the gift of what my values are in operating a business at the end of the day and I see especially in that stepb back period leadership strategy crunch in numbers that’s my value system that’s what I love what can I do with those skill sets and values I can take care of teams and operations and systems and allow them to be the best versions of themselves in the delivery of that care and have learned to give them what the not give them in the sense of like you know a mom and dad you know kind of atmosphere but allow them the opportunity to get into work and do what they do best and what they went to school for and what they are trained to do and where their hearts and passions are at because mine is in managing all the systems right so for all the great love I’ve had one of the trade-offs and Gifts that’s been given to me is I used to just carry this huge weight about what’s going on in patient care am all that type of stuff but that’s not really my weight within the operations and so the gift has been to learn things in real time to be able to know what my values are you know as a leader as a professional in an organization and what I mean for the viewers out there as well too is that I hear a lot of you know whether it’s our patient demographic or individuals and friends that I encounter they’re like I want to be a physical therapist I want to be this over here and I think we point a lot at the job and we could do better as a world about pointing at the values because when you know your values whether it’s Peaks recovery centers for me or a hospital system or a tech company or whatever I can work in any industry now at least that’s the way I see myself within this world and it feels like such a relief because it’s not limiting you know in that regard so showing back up to Peaks like the gift is like I’m wholly excited to be here because I know what that values and I can apply these values and skill sets here to the benefit of other individuals Within These programs so you know again just kind of recapitulate Entrepreneurship gives you a lot of life lessons it kicks your ass in real time in a way that you know even pursuing my NBA program here in the near future you I know I’m not going to get a lot of that out of the program I’ve already received the gifts of you know leadership and those benefits but at the same time giving that value uh construct as well too and then I think you know from a Brotherhood standpoint as well too how many people even in interviews outside of Peaks that I’ve stepped into it’s like I would have killed my brother too it’s like we we have killed each other you know and Dylan coming into the organization as well too you know like he’s fought us as the younger brother as he naturally would and then we turn to him and say dude we’ve been doing this for a decade you’ve only been doing this for us for a couple years so like we appreciate the intensity but we know how to throw blows in a different sort of way uh and to survive a process in which we recognize to the viewers out there from like a mental health standpoint we were prepared to start it from a mental health standpoint but we were not prepared to drive it to where it was at and it took took the teachings and lessons from fellow staff uh clinical care the Psychedelic movement a variety of different things to get us right sized and centered to be the professional that we are in this moment and to be the rock I think finally in the wave of crashing water uh in that regard so that would be my whole capitulation of what these gifts have been like yeah I think it’s a really well stated thank you it’s moving into this 10th year um I’ve really seen a d Dynamic approach from you that I hadn’t seen before specifically to what you just noted is you’ve taken this time to kind of zoom out and now you’re passionately putting people in positions that they’re passionate about and getting the best out of them and I think that’s what great leaders do is they look at systems they identify to your point what’s your value here and you put them in front of something that’s really valuable for them so that they too just like us as entrepreneurs and being business owners they can drive with a tremendous amount of fortitude and passion into that process which I think is absolutely huge and it’s been just an incredible joy to have you back in the organization over the last 5 weeks um even more grateful to have you on the show today to be connected and I want to remind the viewers of one thing um that we started with that we continue regardless of what the industry payer sources uh do we continue to run on this constant thread from a cultural perspective it says nobody cares what you know until they know that you care and that is something that will always live in value at Peaks 24 hours at a time yeah and to not steal the hook but just to you know reinvite it in that may be the fundamental aspect of what quality means in our industry at least for a time period is caring caring fundamentally matters because caring is that ability to uh build that rapport with the individual with the hope of exchanging that relational aspect into a future uh that is Guided by a recovery journey and so in the interim period it’s not even though we point at pains of recovery centers and behavioral health programs and challenges that they face and cell phones and these types of things that we’re scrambling out at the end of the day I have no doubt in most of the programs that I’ve worked in there is a team that is operating that cares and that cares for your loved one to be well uh in that regard and that’s certainly the principal and priority at Peaks recovery yeah really appreciate it man so grateful to have you back until next time peace [Music] you