In this episode, Karen discusses the two different approaches and perceptions of pain in labour. These are the medical approach where pain in labour is seen as dysfunctional and something to be ‘fixed’, and the holistic (midwifery) approach where it is seen as a functional discomfort that is purposeful and therefore important to ‘work with’. It is a fascinating conversation that we hope will plant many seeds that will continue to change the way we think and feel about labour and birth for the better as a culture.