Around the world, Black Lives Matter and their allies - are demanding justice -- and structural change -- in response to years upon years of racist violence, marginalization, and repression. In many instances, activists are being met with further state violence at the hands of police and resistance from elected representatives and officials.

Despite state intransigence, one of the core demands gaining traction right now is the movement to ‘defund the police’. But what does that mean? And, moreover, could it happen? Are we on the brink of lasting, foundational change?

Is this time different?

On this episode of Open to Debate, David Moscrop talks with Fabio Rojas, professor of sociology at Indiana University Bloomington.