Show Notes

In this episode of Career Downloads, host Manuel Martinez sits down with Cynthia Hara, a successful cybersecurity sales executive, who shares her fascinating journey from aspiring fashion designer to thriving tech sales leader.

Growing up in Silicon Valley with an engineer father, Cynthia initially planned a career in fashion design. A pivotal moment at a career fair changed her trajectory, leading her to discover opportunities in technology and sales. She openly shares how she turned what could have been seen as a disadvantage – being one of few women in her information systems classes – into a strategic career advantage.

Cynthia provides practical insights on:

• 
  
• Starting in tech sales with no prior experience
  
• Making the transition from cold calling to enterprise sales
  
• Building and maintaining professional relationships
  
• Negotiating salaries and benefits effectively
  
• Creating valuable business networks
  
• Establishing yourself as a trusted advisor
  
• Starting a non-profit to support women in tech
  

A particularly valuable segment covers her approach to mentorship and coaching, explaining the crucial differences between the two and how to leverage both for career growth. Cynthia also discusses how she built her professional brand and shares strategies for standing out in a competitive field.

This episode is essential listening for anyone interested in tech sales, career transitions, or professional development. Whether you’re just starting your career or looking to advance to the next level, Cynthia’s experiences and advice provide actionable insights you can implement today.

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Connect with our host:

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Connect with our guest:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cynthiahara/

#CareerDownloads #TechSales #CareerAdvice #WomenInTech #ProfessionalDevelopment

Transcript

Manuel: Welcome everyone, my name is Manuel Martinez and this is another episode of Career Downloads, where each episode I basically hit the refresh button, bring on a different guest to learn more about their background, their experience, and just the different ways that they’ve managed their career, to really be able to pull out those actionable items for you that you can go ahead and implement as you’re managing your own career. So for today’s episode, I have with me Cynthia Hara and we met a few years ago. She is on the technology sales side and she’s done a lot of interesting side projects. There’s a lot of speaking that she’s done, so I think she brings a wealth of experience. Not everybody wants to do the hands-on keyboard, but she still is involved in technology, understands a lot of that and some of the business problems, so I think there’s a lot of good information that she’s going to provide to everybody. So with that, go ahead and plug in and download the knowledge and I will introduce Cynthia.

Cynthia: Awesome, thank you so much for having me.

Manuel: I appreciate you coming on. It’s definitely something that I think is of interest, so I’ve, you know, I think around the time that we met, I was also on the sales side, but I was on the sales engineer and, you know, you’re more on the account manager side, but definitely I think that you’re going to provide a lot of good information just in the conversations we’ve had, you know, indirectly and on our own.

Cynthia: Awesome, well thank you.

Manuel: So just to kind of, what I’ve been doing with everybody is if you just briefly tell me kind of what your current role is and some of the responsibilities and then, you know, from there we’ll kind of, we’ll start at the beginning and just kind of work up to that.

Cynthia: All right, yeah, so when I know when you and I met a few years ago, I was working as an account executive for a global cybersecurity company. And then since then, I now work at another cybersecurity company. So I moved about three years ago. So I just finished my three years at Rubrik. And so I’m still doing account executive. What that means is I’m customer facing. So working with customers to essentially identify, you know, what are their cybersecurity initiatives? How can we help them from a ransomware recovery perspective? And then, you know, having more executive level conversations around how do we continue to improve, especially because as you know, you know, security attacks keep on going up. And the cost of that always goes up as well. So just trying to help them manage their risk. And so I’ve been loving it. Yeah, so that’s, it’s basically the summary. I mean, a quick summary of my job.

Manuel: Cool. And now, if you don’t mind giving me a, and again, you can, doesn’t have to be in full detail, but just give me an idea of kind of a little bit of your background, kind of where you grew up, and then eventually what got you interested in technology. And then I guess kind of eventually, you know, into that realm.

Cynthia: Yeah, I grew up in the Bay Area. So really the heart of technology. But when I was growing up, I never really considered technology for myself. My dad was an engineer, though. But I just, I thought I was going to go into fashion. So I used to Google, you know, free fashion internships.com to try and find something nothing they’d never pay in the fashion industry. So you had to work for free. But I went to a career fair for an art school thinking I was going to go into an art program, be a fashion designer, get on Project Runway, move to New York City. And I vividly remember I was standing in line behind this, this young woman, and she had a pizza box and just opens up this pizza box that all these types of her artwork, textiles, you know, sketching. And in my head, I was like, Oh, God, I am not creative enough for this. So I quickly pivoted, I said I would go into business school. And so I ended up going to Cal Poly SLO, go Mustangs, and studied business there. And it was in the business program that you could pick concentrations. So you had to take at least one class from each concentration. And one thing I noticed when I took my information systems one was, I was one of maybe a couple of women in the class. And I thought, you know, this could maybe be to my advanced advantage in the future. So I decided to concentrate in information systems. And that’s pretty much why I’m here today.

Manuel: And what was it that really made you think that that was going to be an advantage? Because a lot of times, just in my own experience and talking to other people, sometimes they feel that that might be almost a disadvantage, right? Like there’s so many other people that, you know, in that case, so many other males, I’m the lone female, or, you know, one of probably a handful. So what made you think that that’s an advantage versus a disadvantage?

Cynthia: Yeah, that’s a great question. I guess I’ve never really been asked that before. I guess I just look at things differently. I never looked at that as that’s going to be a disadvantage to me. I think that, you know, in this day and age to everything’s so competitive, that you want to stand out. So if I can immediately stand out just by being the only woman, then I was like, that that already will, you know, set me apart. And then from there, I also need to make sure that I know my stuff and can be, you know, seen as appear for maybe some of the male colleagues that I would have. So I didn’t really look at it as like, Oh, this is going to be scary. I’m the only girl. It was kind of like, Okay, this I can stand out and then take it from there. Yeah, yeah.

Manuel: And then having your dad as an engineer, I mean, was there any kind of exposure? Did he I mean, I know you mentioned that you were in a fashion, but was there any kind of like, hey, engineering or were you exposed to it even just seeing him do it at home?

Cynthia: Not really. Actually, he was pretty, pretty hands off in terms of, you know, what I wanted to do, you know, they were my parents are both very supportive if I were to pick fashion. And of course, after realizing that I maybe want to stick to something a little bit more technical than creativity, they were still supportive of that as well. I wish I could say more like, Oh, yeah, you know, I was learning technology as a young kid in the in the Silicon Valley, but it really wasn’t like that. I just wanted to do something that, you know, I could still have I was thinking I would have like a day job, you know, work at a desk, but look cute, that was going to be my way of channeling my fashion, my pre fashion notions into just my everyday outfit. But I just I kind of stumbled into cybersecurity, if I’m being completely honest, I was taking an information systems class, which was about networking, actually. So I was just learning about firewalls and the OSI model. And I had a sorority sister post in our Facebook group chat saying, Hey, my dad works for this cybersecurity company. They’re looking for business development reps, if anyone’s interested. And senior year, I was interviewing for the big four, you know, looking at jobs like business tech analysts. So in my head, I was like, Oh, business development rep, business tech analysts, they’re the same thing. So I ended up interviewing. And I didn’t know that it was sales. I never thought I would go into sales. I always thought that’s the last thing I want to do. I never want to do sales. And I didn’t realize business development rep was a fancy way of saying cold caller. So I went through the interview process. And they were like, Yeah, you know, this, this is a sales job, you know that, right? And I’m like, Yeah, yeah,

Manuel: You got to be confident at that point.

Cynthia: Of course. And they’re like, Yeah, you know, we’re you should check out our stock price, we’re doing pretty well. And that this, this point, it was like 2016 ish 2017. So I’m looking up their stock price. I’m like, Oh, this stock price isn’t bad. So I just kept going with the interview process. And that’s pretty much how I landed in cybersecurity. I had taken this firewall class. So I knew that this company does firewalls. I’m like, Okay, I’m set.

Manuel: And it’s funny, because you bring up a, an important part is a lot of times a lot of these job postings, they sound similar, right? Like you thought, Oh, you know, business development, business analyst, and even reading the descriptions in most of these companies, like, you’ll get like this two page thing, mainly talking about the company itself. And there’s a little blurb about, Hey, this is what you’re going to do. And so I, I can only imagine that that was quite a shock. But I’m glad that you, you know, you apparently had the, I don’t want to say not just confidence, but like the ability to just kind of remain calm and say, Oh, yeah, of course, I’m still interested, right?

Cynthia: You got to pivot, you got to pivot guys.

Manuel: Would you think that you’re a quick, like, are you quick on your feet like that normally, like to be able to just say, Hey, yes, I mean, most people, you know, might freeze or say, well, I don’t know, or just kind of change their mind, but you decided to go through.

Cynthia: I think one thing I can do pretty well is like fast decision making. And also I don’t want to look silly. So I’m like, if it just means saying like, Yeah, absolutely, I knew that was sales. That’s easy. Obviously, there’s certain situations where I would have to roll it back a little bit. But for this one, I was like, Well, I’m looking for a job. I thought this was a tech job, I guess it’s sales, but you’re selling technology so close enough. And in fact, actually going through the interview process, they, you know, we’re talking to me like, Okay, so you don’t have any corporate experience. Oh, you don’t have sales experience. You know, we’re looking for some with a little bit more experience. So here, how about you read this book and come back to us in 30 days if you still want to try this? And it was a The Challenger Sale book, if you knew that one at all, and there’s so many sales books out there, but they had me read this book. So I spent the next, you know, couple weeks going through reading about how you, you know, essentially you’re challenging a customer, ask them different questions, because, you know, maybe they just they want to stay with the status quo. So it’s about that. And then I came back 30 days later, I was like, I read the book, I think it’s interesting, still would love to go for the job if you still have a position open. So they said, Sure. So that’s what that’s what allowed me to just continue going through the process. I think, I think they wanted to see if I would follow up, which is a good sales skill. I didn’t know this at the time. But making sure that, you know, actually, I did what they wanted me to and that I followed up with them to see if there was still an open position. So I think they were like, Okay, let’s just let’s give her a shot.

Manuel: It’s interesting because I mean, you said it, right? In sales, specifically, right? They want to make sure that they have somebody that goes through and follows up with the customer, right? In that case, it’s with them. But then the other thing is probably like, they’re also giving you an out, like, maybe she doesn’t really want to do this.

Cynthia: Right, right. Exactly. Like a nice way of saying, Hey, maybe this isn’t for you. I don’t know. So, but I’m glad I went through with it. I mean, obviously, it’s led me to where I am today. But it is interesting, those like little moments of where, you know, someone did put up a little bit of an obstacle and just wanted to test the waters to see if I could get through it. And obviously, this is just reading a book, but it’s minor one. I guess I could have stopped at any moment.

Manuel: But in that book, after reading that book, did you decide that? Is it more just, Hey, I just want to get some experience. So I’ll take it. Or was it, Hey, this actually doesn’t sound so bad. It sounds like something I can do. Like, let me actually give it a shot.

Cynthia: I mean, and what I really love about sales now, which I didn’t see, you know, back then and having never done sales before is, you know, if you can find a product that works well, then you can be the sales rep that just wants to help you find a solution, right? Knowing that you’ve got a good product behind you, how can we help? I like that aspect. I think my previous connotation of sales was like a car sales rep trying to make the most money out of you and being really sleazy with different sales tactics. And I’ve never liked that. So I didn’t think I wanted to do it. And then now being in a role where I’m like, Okay, like, I’m just trying to help find a problem, right? Let’s find a problem. And then we can put together a solution to help you with this problem. And hopefully it fits within your budget we’ll work with you. Right? Like that, that to me is a more interesting conversation and also more fun because I don’t feel like I’m trying. I don’t know. I hope I don’t give off that vibe to a customer. I don’t think I do. But of them thinking like, Oh, she’s just here to make money off of me. Like, I don’t want to do that. If I could sell it to you for free, I would. But I got bills to pay too.

Manuel: And I agree, right? It’s it’s a lot easier to have those types of conversations when it’s something that and having the understanding of like, Hey, how firewalls work, what the implications are. So you’re really just trying to help. And I think, I mean, I’ve never been one of your customers. But the interactions I’ve had with you, it’s very much, you know, you give off that feeling of like, Hey, I’m just, I just want to know more about your environment and know more about you. How can I help? And, you know, so I can’t imagine that they see you as the sleazy car salesperson.

Cynthia: I would hope not. I think that’s like, I had a customer tell me like, you’re really chill sales rep. I’m like, perfect. But one thing I mean, I’ve gotten better at this now over the years is more around like manifestation. And just knowing that, okay, as long as I’m doing the right things for my customer, and I’m not trying to chase money, like money will always come. I guess that’s my new motto. Because before I even last year, I think I was really stressed out and kind of being like, Oh my God, I’m not going to hit my numbers. And I know it’s tough. But then just as long as I kept putting in the, you know, all the things I needed to following up with customers, being responsive, also understanding like a customer says not right now, don’t keep hammering them right, just leave them alone for a bit, they come back. And so that’s really been helpful for me where I’m like, I’m not chasing money, it money attracts, I attract money.

Manuel: And that’s funny. Within probably the last year, I’ve had somebody that kind of did the same thing. So do you so manifestation is one thing, but do you also set goals kind of for yourself? Because one of the things, and I had a friend of mine, Janetta, where she went through and talked about, okay, same thing, as long as you’re doing the right steps, the right processes, it will pay off, right? It’s not going to be in said like, Oh, I did these five things tomorrow, it’s coming. It’ll come when it’s supposed to. But then also, she had said, you know, write it down, even if it’s a sticky note, it’s better if you see it all the time. But just the simple act of like writing your goals, like, Hey, this is the numbers I want to hit. Here’s the things that I am going to accomplish at that time. Are you at that level? Or are you just kind of thinking privately to yourself like, This is what I’m going to do. This is what’s going to happen.

Cynthia: Yeah. Interesting. She said to write down, I agree, because manifestation without goals is just dreaming, you know, like it’s it’s nice thought they’re nice thoughts. When I first moved to Vegas, and this was five years ago, I put down, you know, what my list of goals are going to be. And my first one was be the number one, you know, go to cybersecurity advisor in Nevada. And so, you know, since that time, I think I’ve just been, you know, gener… building relationships with people to the point where, you know, my customers know who I am, or they can speak highly of me to refer me to other customers. And so that’s been the way where I’m like, Okay, that’s still something I’m working on, because I don’t think it’s something you just achieve and then are done, right? It’s a continual process. But I did write it down.

Manuel: And then you’ve, is it something you revisit? Or is it just to kind of like, Hey, I wrote it down, and I’m done.

Cynthia: I check it, probably I should do it more. I do once, like every year, check in. So like, I have my, you know, my 2019 goals, 2020, 2021. I didn’t write down this year’s. So I’ve been bad. But I guess they haven’t really changed since last year.

Manuel: That’s awesome. So you come into this new role, right? Obviously not thinking that you’re going to be cold calling. What were some of the challenges that you had there? Because I couldn’t imagine that it’s not fun getting, I’m assuming you’re probably getting rejected easily, maybe 60, 70% of the time. So what was that process?

Cynthia: Yeah, it was, it was rough. I was very lucky. I found I had a great manager to start off my first corporate job, first sales job, she was immediately trying to connect me with mentors. So we can talk about mentorship later. But I think it, it ended up being something where I found a lot of cust or coworkers that I could bond with to help us through the trauma, if you will, and the rejection, but we would come up with, you know, sales campaigns and what are messaging that worked. So I do think, like, if you, if you are going to pick that sort of role to find people that you can, you know, share experiences with, maybe like what’s been working, what’s not been working and make it sort of a community effort in a way, like, hey, if this sales, like messaging, like this talk track is working for you, shared out with your team. So I think finding community in that helped a lot. But it was definitely hard. I think I did it for about 11 months. By the ninth month, I was telling my VP of inside sales. Amy, she’s awesome. I was like, I want to quit. I don’t think this is for me. Like maybe I want to go into channel or maybe I want to be an engineer. I don’t know. And she was like, well, you’re really good with people. So just stick it out. Like, yeah, the cold calling sucks. But if you can get in front of customers, I think you’ll have a much better experience. So by the 11th month, I was able to get promoted. So I went from cold caller to an inside sales rep, meaning I supported field reps like myself now. I had about seven or eight field reps I supported across the Nevada, Arizona, Utah, Colorado, New Mexico. And I would help them find a new business in their customer base or help them manage their customers, right, like doing health checks, like very customer success type type of role. But then also run like small, small deals. And that was a good way for me to say, okay, actually, I really like talking to customers, not when I’m cold calling them trying to get time. And they’re like, you know, why should we talk to you? Goodbye. So being an inside sales rep helped me to see that, okay, I could maybe be a field rep.

Manuel: It kind of gave you a, and is that kind of my design, the way that they do, like being a gradual progression, right? Because one, you get that experience. And they’re probably also weeding out people that, you know, hey, this is sales isn’t for me, but now you’ve kind of moved into this junior sales rep. And it’s awesome that you had kind of mentors and just people that could see the potential. And as an inside sales rep, I mean, it sounds like you’re supporting, like you said, seven different sales reps across a wide range of territories. How did you work through managing all those different things? Because it’s different when you have like your set of accounts, you’re working with one person. Is that something that you’ve kind of developed over time getting better, the follow through and making sure that you’re not missing things? I can assume that at that level, there’s a chance that you might forget something right not on purpose, but it could happen.

Cynthia: Absolutely. The biggest thing that helped me was building my brand. So that was one of the first things that my manager told me. Delphina, she’s amazing too. But she was saying that, you know, you, you, everyone’s always watching was one of the first things she said. So she was like, you better be doing a lot of the right activity, but then also now you have to let people know that you’re doing this activity or else, how are they going to know that everyone has their own stuff to be thinking about. So, you know, building relationships with my field reps, like starting to reach out to all of them, get time on their calendars, you know, have a list ready of, Hey, here are all the prospects I found in your, in your account base that I’m going to be going after. Here are some current customers that I see some maybe expansion opportunities. And so, you know, just start to look impressive because there’s people more than you think there’s people that can’t do what you’re doing, right? So if you can start to do that more consistently, and then, you know, reach out to the their, their managers, so we called them district sales managers, that was essentially the, the field rep or field man, field manager, field sales manager, and reach out to him to start building a relationship with him so that he knows you’re here and you’re here to help here and send an email, you know, don’t have to set up a call every time, but send like a weekly progress email, here are all the meetings that I set up, you know, here’s the ones that convert into opportunities, like start to do all that so that people start being like, Oh, Cynthia, like is is doing stuff. And like, look at all the help that she’s doing with these reps and basically just have the reps like for my strategy was get the reps talking about how much they like working with me. And so that that made other sales reps that weren’t because not every set, not all seven was we’re going to take me up on that, right? But if I could find like a couple that were seeing like, okay, she seems like she’s interested and wants to help like, sure, let’s have her roll with it and then start to be like, Oh, wow, Cynthia got me into this, you know, white space account or she set up this meeting and it turned into this opportunity, then I had my other sales reps be like, well, hold on a second, I want to work with her too. So and then even had the other, you know, field reps be like, what are like this? What’s this team doing that? Like, how can we do that in our team? So there were reps that weren’t even on my team that were starting to hit like hit up there inside sales reps being like, Hey, have you talked to Cynthia? So that was one of the the strategies because at this point, I was like, okay, I want to go into the field, but how do I get to the field? And so it was building a relationship with those field reps that then would say, yeah, you should totally like, I could see you as a field rep and and basically help spread the word. So a little bit of a long term play.

Manuel: And that’s perfect, right? And you mentioned kind of building your brand. And that’s something that I always was taught at an early age. So my dad ran construction business. And I remember, you know, I had the advantage of, you know, he’s the boss. And there’d be a lot of times where I’m like, Oh, you know, I thought I was being sneaky as a, you know, like teenager and going and hanging out and not doing stuff. And one of the things, and he brought it to my attention as me as an individual, but then he would notice, you know, with his workers, he’s like, people, someone’s always watching, right? Hey, just because the boss isn’t there, doesn’t mean that the coworkers are there’s, you know, hey, there’s other people like they’re seeing the activities you’re doing. So if I’m, you know, I could have easily have been branded like, Oh, the boss is son, who just sits in the corner and does nothing all day, right? And eventually I was like, Oh, okay, I guess, I guess you’re right. I guess I should do the work just like everybody else. So doing those types of activities. And you mentioned, you know, kind of putting all this together. Do you have a strategy for how you maintain and kept track of all of these types of things? I mean, it sounds like it’d be beneficial in your role. But even just me, I’ll tell you that I don’t, I’m not the best at always keeping track of the activity. So what is it that you do?

Cynthia: Back then I was working on like a Saturday, I would just post up at a coffee shop and put together some lists. Now I just tried to allocate like even an hour just to say, okay, you know, who are the people I really need to follow up with tomorrow? And who, what did I not get to today that I really need to work on and work a little bit extra at in the evenings? But it is really just setting aside some time and just saying, okay, in this hour, how much can we get done in terms of what did I do? What did I not do? What do I need to do next? I’m putting a little bit more structure. But when I was going up from like inside sales to field sales, I was so focused on being a field sales rep that for me saying, okay, I’m going to spend all Saturday to work on these lists was worth it.

Manuel: Those lists that you were keeping track of or even just like that hour that you’re setting aside, you know, do you keep like a running list of kind of what you’re doing? Or is it, hey, by me planning and me sending these emails, I can just aggregate these emails later?

Cynthia: So it was more of a running list because that way when I would take, when I would get something done, I would just take it off the list. So it was a nice way to say, okay, I wrote some stuff yesterday that I didn’t get done. Okay, I need to prioritize those. Or it gives me an opportunity to say, is this really a priority? Does it need to be done? Maybe I thought it was, but now looking back, there’s other things that should be more higher priority.

Manuel: So you’re obviously starting to establish a name for yourself as, you know, somebody who is obviously efficient, is helpful. And you mentioned that other reps and not even within your territory, but outside are trying to replicate and understand what it is that you’re doing. So how long did it take for you to kind of establish yourself as that type of worker or that type of person?

Cynthia: Yeah, maybe in about six months or so, after getting into the next roll up. So like as the lowest level of business development rep, I was like, okay, I know now, as soon as I got into this role that everyone’s always watching, I had another coworker actually tell me, err perception is everything. So, you know, no one has to really know what’s going on behind the scenes, but whatever you’re showing to the world, that’s what they think is real. Or uh perception is reality, was the quote, right? So I did the BDR job for about 11 months, got promoted and so came in, guns a blazing into this inside sales rep to say, okay, I’m going to be the best inside sales rep that any rep will have so that they talk about it and, you know, like maybe help promote me to the next level. So I did that for about 10 months, 11 months, and then I ended up getting the field rep position. But I’ll back up a little bit. Essentially, I had a field rep leave, she got a different opportunity to be a global account manager somewhere else. So the Nevada and Arizona market was open for named accounts for private sector. And so I played field rep with my boss’s permission and the field DSM’s permission to say, hey, can I work some of these accounts, because there’s no account coverage. And they were like, sure, whatever, we’re not giving you a raise, but but you can absolutely work them. So I paired up with my with the field SE (Sales Enginner) at the time, and then he and I just, I would set up all the meetings, you know, have like a full day in Arizona, again, Phoenix or in Vegas, and then fly home to the Bay Area, or I would spend a couple days. So I started to be the field rep in a way. And that helped as well, because, you know, to get to the next step up, sometimes you just have to start doing that job. So people visualize it and say, okay, you know, she could she could do it. So I, I ended up just playing field rep and getting good experience from actually, you know, doing leading a presentation in front of customers or bringing in the right resources to talk about, you know, some kind of overlay product. And ended up, you know, interviewing for that position, did not get it. There was a new manager that came on board. And he essentially, you know, he graciously let me interview. But after I was done, he was like, you know, that was good. But we’re actually looking for someone in Vegas that already has, you know, connections. And so that kind of disqualifies you. And so that was a bummer. But at the same time, at least it gave me the opportunity to put my foot out or put my put my name out there. And then the public sector manager reached out to me. And he was like, hey, I heard you’re interested in a position in Nevada or Arizona, we’re hiring for someone in Vegas. Are you interested? And I’d never done public sector before. But I just decided, okay, you know, this is one of those another one door closes another door open situation. So I interviewed for that position and got it. So that’s what really brought me from the Bay Area to Vegas.

Manuel: One of the things I really want to touch on that you mentioned is having that open position. And I’m assuming you had the confidence and the drive to want to go through it. Not many times when people go through and and ask for that opportunity. So is that just something that you kind of thought of on your own on the spot and just said, Hey, if I can prove that I can do the job, they’re going to give me the opportunity. Or, you know, especially because you said, you’re not getting promoted, you can do the work, it’s more work, but you’re not getting the pay, right? You’re going to continue to be the inside sales rep. So really what kind of pushed you to go through and do that, right? And take that step because a lot of people might say, well, it’s open. I guess I have to wait for like an actual posting or something like that.

Cynthia: Yeah, I had a mentor say ask for forgiveness later. So I was just, you know, starting to set up meetings and whatnot and then went to my boss and was like, Hey, you know, there’s opportunities here that we’re missing out on. Can I cover it? And like, would that be okay? I’ll still do my other job. So I think just going for it, you know, don’t be scared. The worst they can say is no, right? You already have a job. It’s not like you’re going to get fired for doing more work. Like if anything, it’s in the company’s best interest probably to have you, you know, do something that they technically need to pay someone else way more money to do. So I kind of felt like a win-win because I got the experience and then, you know, they got to have a little bit of coverage while they didn’t have anyone there. And I cost less than a field position.

Manuel: And not being afraid of no, right? So, you know, that experience of being that cold caller and getting no a lot. And sure, you know, you mentioned, you know, kind of leaning on each other, but did that repetitiveness basically make you feel comfortable in knowing that no is not the end of the world, right? Like you’re just going to be a lot of no’s before you get a yes. But a lot of times we’re scared of like that rejection. Oh, somebody says no or, you know, just in any situation, not even just in sales, right? Like, oh, hey, why don’t you go? It reminds me of I saw a video of a person that goes through and to work negotiations. And it says what they would do is the people that are really good at it started small. Every time they would go to like a coffee shop or anywhere, hey, can I get a discount? Can I get a 5% discount? And they would just say, no, you can’t. Okay. And you just get comfortable with what’s the worst that’s going to happen. They’ll say no. Do you think that that early part really influenced the ability to go through and now you’re taking those those bigger shots? It sounds like you also have mentors though that are kind of telling you, hey, do this. But they can tell you all day. But if you don’t feel comfortable doing it, you’re not going to. So, so far, are all those experiences kind of shaping and molding that?

Cynthia: I believe so. Yeah, that was one thing that I learned very on or early on with the cold calling, right? Is that if someone says no, it’s not because they’re saying no to you as a person. It’s just they’re saying no to whatever you’re offering. So it you have to kind of take yourself out of it in a way. It’s not personal, right? They’re just saying no to the offer. But it’s not like they’re saying like, no, Cynthia, we hate you. And I had some customers that are prospects I’ve heard and no one’s ever screamed at me over the phone. So maybe that’s, you know, that part of that when I hear some of my co workers that would tell me that they got screamed at by like when I was a BDR. And they’re like, Oh, well, they probably not yelling at you because you’re a girl. I don’t know. Maybe I can’t prove that or also, you know, say that that’s, you know, not true or is true or whatever. But that could be your tone of voice. I don’t know how they’re, you know, aggressively calling someone. But even if I’ve never been screamed at on the phone, even if someone says no, it’s not anything personal. So I think that’s the biggest lesson. And then even now in my other or in my new life, just being able to ask for more. And even if it’s a no, it’s not a big deal. Like, okay, you know,

Manuel: You won’t know if you don’t try.

Cynthia: Yeah, exactly. Miss all the shots you don’t take.

Manuel: So that’s pretty cool. Again, now you didn’t apply for this public sector position. But again, you mentioned it’s establishing your brand, being that type of person, interviewing. And I’m assuming that that person that you interviewed that told you no, probably maybe even told this other person. I mean, did you ever find out anything like that or just?

Cynthia: I don’t know. I don’t know. So I can’t confirm that. I just do know that I knew some of the field reps loosely from that team. So I don’t know who referred me really. But it was also small enough of a company where even the managers all talk to each other. So it’s very possible. Yeah.

Manuel: So then you get this, did they just offer you the position? Did you have to interview?

Cynthia: I still interviewed, but it was, you know, I already worked for the company. So they were like, let’s see how you do a pitch. And then I did a pitch and they’re like, okay, you’re hired.

Manuel: I’m sure a lot of the prior work that you’ve done before also helps, right? Oh, it’s not like you’re coming off the street.

Cynthia: I think now, because they’ve grown so much, they have a very, very formal way of interviewing people. So that maybe isn’t the case anymore. But this one, they were like, okay, can do you know the product? You can build relationships, check, okay, you know, you’re hungry. You can do the job. We’re looking for someone this year. Why don’t you give it a go type of thing? I don’t know if I’m diminishing it, but.

Manuel: And now that challenge of you’re in a new territory, you were working with people in Nevada, but now this is public sector. So it’s, it’s kind of a new territory because it’s a completely different set of contacts in that area. It’s a new state. And I’m assuming at this point, you moved as well. So there’s a lot of changes, new place, you’re having to deal with the challenges of, I’ve had to find a new place. I’ve got to, you know, basically settle yourself in at the same time, you still got to do your job. So what was that like?

Cynthia: It was a lot. I basically moved here, had no friends, except my customers that I worked with in the private sector side. So I, you know, this is all in a whole new customer base. And I actually remember I reached out, I got a beer with one of my previous customers on the private sector side. And I was telling him, like, yeah, I just, you know, I don’t know anyone here. I’m really excited, but a little nervous. And he was like, well, do you want to come have dinner with my wife and I? I’m making cedar plank salmon if you want to come over. And looking back, I’m like, this could be the start of a true crime documentary. But at the time I was like, I need some friends. Like, yeah, let’s do it. So I went to this customer’s house and he luckily was not a serial killer. He had cedar plank salmon. And I enjoyed a lovely dinner with him and his wife. But yeah, I guess long story short was I was very excited to meet people, but it had really no way to do that because all I knew were people from work. So I did convince my best friend to move. She used to be a bartender in Washington. So I convinced her to move to Vegas because I was like, you can do the same job, but in Vegas, make way more money, live with me. And you know, there’s UNLV, CSN, if you ever want to go to school, like it’s a win-win.

Manuel: Selling already.

Cynthia: Yeah, I know. I had a sales presentation for reasons why you should move to Vegas. And she moved. So we lived together and then COVID happened. It was about nine months living in Vegas. And then COVID obviously shut everything down, which put a huge wrench in, you know, all the fun plans I had for us and to meet with customers on site. I mean, that just went out the window for a while. The deals that I had working were gone. I mean, Clark County was like, Hey, we lost a billion dollars in a week. So we’re not buying anything. And so that was a crazy adjustment as well. And I think it was a blessing that I lived in Nevada, because as you know, Vegas opened back up pretty quickly. Within a few months, I would say things were somewhat back to normal, maybe like bare bones ish, right? Whereas if I was in California, a lot of my California peers, no one was meeting. Everyone’s very locked down. People didn’t even want to talk. So I am glad that I did live here where it was a little bit more 50 50 open, but careful type of thing. But yeah, I mean, it, it just took a long time of just building relationships with my partners and new customers. Slowly just living here where I joined the gym, I started to do sort of external type activities to start to build a bit more of a community here to now I feel like, okay, I have my friend group, you know, my family here. So

Manuel: and that had to be quite a challenge, right? So like you said, you’re starting to try and establish a relationship with some of these people. And then now all of a sudden, you can’t meet with them. You can’t really build that. I’m sure at first it was kind of okay doing the Zoom, but I remember that they would get that Zoom fatigue, right? Like, they wouldn’t want to meet or it’s almost kind of back to the cold calling days where you’re talking to them on a Zoom call, but nobody has their cameras on. So how did you continue or what are, what are some of the ways that you were able to kind of still establish that relationship? Even though you kind of don’t, you know, it’s almost like a phone only relationship.

Cynthia: Yeah, it ended up actually working out because I was, you know, trying to get people’s cell phone numbers to just start to build a relationship over the phone and say, Okay, can we text, you know, this Zoom, let’s not get on a Zoom meeting, you know, can I just text you or can I just call you. So it was a, maybe a way to just kind of start building a relationship. I know it was virtual, but people build virtual relationships all the time. So it ended up being okay. And then as soon as offices could meet in person, I would say, Hey, can I bring lunch? You know, like, can we just meet in person and grab a coffee or something? So it ended up being a way to use like the Zoom fatigue as a way to try and meet in person again. I don’t know if that necessarily answered the question, but it was just more trying to find all kinds of different alternate solutions. Or if someone said, I like meeting in Zoom, I’d be like, me too, you know, Zooms not so bad, let’s put on our cameras. Or if someone’s like, Yeah, I don’t want to do a Zoom meeting. I’m like, you know what? Yeah, I’m getting carried. Because I felt both ways. It wasn’t a lie. Like sometimes I hated it. Sometimes I didn’t mind it. I’d rather meet in person. So I was a little bit of a chameleon, like whatever worked better for you. I’m down type of thing.

Manuel: So yeah, that’s awesome. I’m having that adaptability. And you did answer the question, right? It’s just how did you do that? And it sounds like being able to go through and say, Hey, can we text? Can I call you? Can I do all these things? So it wasn’t just only Zoom. Okay, let’s find other ways because just like you, I’m tired. But occasionally, you’re like, I do want to put on my camera and talk to you. And so you’re establishing these relationships. It sounds like, you know, things are opening up. Are there any other challenges that you’re seeing around that time? So now things are starting to open up. You’re establishing yourself now as a field rep. So kind of what’s what’s kind of the next thing for Cynthia?

Cynthia: Yeah, yeah, definitely. I think one of the next things for me is, you know, really just working on working on my brand still. So from just my everyday work perspective, one of the things I’ve been focused on is putting together some cool events and kind of being like, Hey, you know, Cynthia’s got a cool like, I just want to embody like, Hey, if you if you’re going to learn from us or do a lunch and learn or whatever, whatever you want to get out of our events, like it’s going to be awesome. So I’ve been trying to establish myself more as that as well. So that if you hear like, Oh, Cynthia from Rubrik is inviting you to an event, it’s going to be a good one, like beneficial in terms of, you know, are you going to learn something? Are you going to meet new people? You know one thing I learned from someone recently was, you know, your network is your currency, right? So if you can call someone and ask them for a favor, and they say, Yeah, like that’s money, right? And so my skill that I’ve learned along the way is that I’m really good at connecting people. So like, if you need someone that, you know, if you know someone that needs to start a business, Hey, I know someone that has literally an entrepreneurship, what do you call them, incubator program, right? So I want to be able to help people in that way and say like, Okay, come to come to my event and you’ll network and meet some awesome people. And that’s my value that I bring. So that’s a big focus of mine. And through that to I started a nonprofit as well. So this is around like women and technology leadership and business. One thing I noticed as I lived in Vegas was, you know, there wasn’t really a women in technology group around here. And I know that there are some in other other cities that I cover, like I now cover the Arizona and Utah. And so there is a big community out in Phoenix, but I was like, Where’s the one in Nevada? So I just decided to take matters into my own hands. And I noticed that in Downtown Summerlin, there used to be a store called Oil and Vinegar. It was like olive oil, fancy olive oils and balsamic vinaigrettes. And I asked if they do private events. And so the lady that worked there was like, Absolutely, we can put together a very nice charcuterie board or cheese spread, you can do like olive oil tastings. And I was like, What woman wouldn’t love that? I love that kind of stuff.

Manuel: I’m not a woman and I want to go.

Cynthia: You know, we are opening it up to men now too. But like for that first event, I was like, You know what? I don’t know any all like charcuterie board type events around here. So I teamed up with a couple other women that I knew were also interested in, you know, this sort of event. And I ended up, you know, sponsoring it between the four of us, or one of each of us all sponsored a little bit through our own our companies and got a group of 34, 35 women there. And since last January, it’s been a success. So January 2023 was our first event. And then since then, we’ve had events almost quarterly, to the point where at the end of last year, I was like, let’s make this official and be a nonprofit. So it’s official Nevada Thrive Network for Women. It’s kind of our group to help women learn from each other, connect with each other, you know, connect other agencies. That was one thing I did to like being a sales rep is what, how can I add more value to my customer, right? If I can connect my customer with a similar peer in another agency saying, Hey, I think you two should meet, then that could be valuable, right? I mean, it could go nowhere or it could go somewhere awesome. So what’s the worst that could happen?

Manuel: Right? No, that’s cool. Just hearing you, you know, kind of your brand and just your personality, just in the things that you’ve talked about, like throughout this conversation, like I mentioned at the beginning, like I can tell that you’re that you’re not that sleazy salesperson, but you are very helpful. Like you’re always looking to try and how can I help? How can I improve? And like you said, your, your network is your currency because to be able to put on your first event and have 34 people show up. That’s, that’s not nothing, right? I mean, I would have, you know, if I were to put something on, I would think to myself, man, if I could get double digits, if I could get 10 people to show up, that’d be amazing. But it sounds like that brand, the ability of like, Hey, if Cynthia is putting something on, because by this time you’ve already done all these other events, you’re establishing that brand is, okay, this is worth going for because even there’s going to be something I’m going to get out of it. And that networking, is that something that you’ve had just a passion for? You’ve developed that skill over time? Like how, how has that kind of grown and that, that influence? Like, what are some of the approaches that you’ve taken to continue to grow your network?

Cynthia: Yeah. Well, first of all, thank you. You’re welcome to come to any of our events there. We, our last one was in August, and we had over 80 people go to that one and over 120 people registered. So that was our big, like every August around Black Hat Def Con, we do our kind of year, like annual big event. So that’s, but most of them we target about like 30 to 40 people ish. But no, in terms of networking, it’s something that I’ve grown to appreciate. When I was in college, I, you know, the term just sounded so stuffy and fake. It just seems fake. But I actually learned a lot about networking from when I was in Greek life in sororities. I, when I went through the rush process, I didn’t realize that you really just have to make a good first impression in under 20 minutes, maybe less, maybe like five, but then, you know, hold a conversation for 20 minutes and have to basically put up in, put up a front in a way of like, you know, you just want the person you’re talking to to have a good experience with you, right? Because you want them to rush your house or want to, want to be in your house. And you don’t necessarily have to show that they would be the right fit for you guys, but you still have to be very warm and welcoming and make someone feel like, oh, like I could see myself in this house. So that was essentially my first taste of networking was talking to, you know, almost a hundred girls, but making them feel welcome. And then considering, okay, would they be like, could they fit with other girls in the house? Could they be a good, you know, good member? Have some friends and build a community, essentially. But at the time, I didn’t realize that was essentially networking. And then going into, you know, the corporate world and realizing that, you know, yeah, anyone I speak to, I want them to have a pleasant experience of me. But I don’t necessarily have to like them. I just don’t like, you just don’t want them to hate you. And so that’s been something I’ve kept up with, you know, throughout my career. And, you know, as you know, there can be some difficult customers. Same thing applies, right? You just have them like you, you’ll have to like them, but they have to like you, because people buy from people. So you just have to kind of put your own, you know, thoughts about someone else to the side and make sure that they at least have a wonderful, you know, experience talking to you or working with you, planning an event with you, that kind of thing.

Manuel: How valuable do you see within networking? Similar to you, right? I remember going to college and, you know, hey, you network and it was just like, oh, that feels gross, right? I don’t want to do that. You mentioned following up as a sales rep. So within networking, to be able to ask somebody, hey, for a favor, hey, meet up with these things, you probably aren’t doing that with somebody that you last talked to maybe eight years ago, unless you have, unless you eight years ago, you established such a great relationship. So what are some of the, probably some of your tips that you would say, how do you continue not only to build your network, but then maintain those relationships within there? Because the other people that you contact with all the day, all the time, but then there’s people that you don’t, but there’s, it’s not that you don’t want to, it’s just.

Cynthia: Yeah, it’s funny you bring that up. I have people that will message me on LinkedIn, basically saying like, hey, how’s it going? Haven’t talked and by the way, haven’t talked to them for, you know, almost a decade. And they’re like, hey, how’s it going? You know, I’m looking at the job at Rubrik, want to see if you would recommend me. And to me, I just, unless I have known them really well in the past, I’m like, yeah, I remember working with you. Like, yeah, you were, you were great. Like that’s fine. But my tip for that is to not lead with something where you’re asking a favor, right? Like if you can, maybe you, you notice that your connection works at a company you want to work for, maybe start with opening up, that’s something that’s going to be relevant for them, right? Like, hey, I saw this event, it reminds me of when, you know, we had gone to this event together, thought this would be interesting for you. How are you doing? Like just opening up the door again for a conversation without necessarily asking a favor immediately, I think is better in a way or more effective. Or I’ll text someone, like if I haven’t seen from, I haven’t heard from them in a while, just say, hey, checking in, like how’s it going? You know, I saw, I remember this thing and it made me think of you. And just still maintaining a light connection. It’s not like you have to be best friends with everyone, because that that’s just simply impossible. But checking in with people that, you know, you wish them well, and maybe there is something that you might need from them in the future, you just don’t want to come to them immediately with that thing if you haven’t talked to them in years. So that’s kind of my trick is I’ll just check in with like some of my old bosses or, you know, people co workers I used to work with or my old mentors, I check in saying, hey, you know, Mr. Chats or hey, I said this one quote, and it reminded me of when you said it to me, like I said that to my mentor in Colorado, where she was saying that she never interviews for a job. And that’s like, that’s just her goal is to never have to interview, have enough good relationships where people just come to you with offers. And so I like told that to someone and texted her just saying, Hey, you said this to me years ago. Appreciate you. But I think those little bits of just sending it’s almost like you’re sending a bid out in a way to a bid for connection. And maintaining that that way, you don’t have to feel like, Hey, oh my gosh, I, I do want a job at this company. And I haven’t talked to this person in years. It just feels a little weird to ask for a recommendation when they don’t even like know you anymore,

Manuel: Right. You know, I’ve noticed that so for a while, I was probably especially like on LinkedIn, right? I was kind of active, I would be in there, but I wasn’t active to the point like where I had been even prior to kind of starting the podcast where I would kind of go through read articles, reach out and just start making connections. And it’s funny, some of the connections that I haven’t talked to in a while, like I, I would see something that they would post. I’m like, Oh, hey, I would message them directly. Hey, how’s it going? And it’s funny that you mentioned like, you know, reaching out to a job because I’ve had a couple of people that have, hasn’t happened often, but a couple of times where they’re almost taken back at the fact that I didn’t ask for something. They’re like, Oh, hey, how’s it all? I was like, Oh, I was just, I thought about you. I saw something he posted. I was just, how’s it going? They’re like, Oh, great. And like, you know, what’s going on there? And the question, the one that stands out to me is Amy, or I don’t remember if it’s Amy, somebody that had gone through and was like, Oh, are you looking for a job? And I’m like, No. And I was like, No, I was just, I’m pretty happy where I’m at. Like it’s like, if at some point I was like, I’ll start looking. I was just, I was just really curious to see how you were because I see that you’re now at this place. And they’re like, Oh, yep. They kind of gave me that, that, you know, their information about their job. But again, it was just that feeling of, Oh, I haven’t talked to this person in three years. They’re reaching out because they want something. So you probably don’t want to probably happens more often than, than not. But then outside of that, you know, are there certain connections that you are reaching out to, to assist? So let’s say you are, let’s say maybe it’s been three years since you’ve talked to them and you’ve had a decent relationship. Again, you’re not asking them for a job. So how are you approaching? Is it kind of the same thing? Just

Cynthia: A little bit. If I, if I have had a conversation, even if it’s been a few years, I can usually just be able to text them a message. Usually, but if I have a good enough relationship, I have their number, right? So I would prefer to text because I feel like that’s the most personal way versus a LinkedIn message. It’s probably there’s a little bit of a level of separation there. So if I have their number and I feel like even if I haven’t talked to them in a while, like there’s a couple like field reps that I still have a good relationship. If I see them out, Hey, how’s it going? So I feel comfortable texting them if they work somewhere where I’m like, mind if you throw in a good word for me, right? But for a LinkedIn message, I think that’s where I like your approach, right? Of commenting or being active, right? Liking something they post or comment on it or send it to them, right? And say, Hey, you know, if you want to make it a little bit more private, you can send their post to them and just say, Hey, this is awesome. I have some questions on it. Like stay engaged in that way. Even offer up your number. Like if I want to continue a relationship with someone and move it off of LinkedIn, make it a little more serious. Here’s my number. If you ever need anything, shoot, like text me. And then, you know, usually if I get a text from them, then I’ll save their number and now I have it. And that just kind of helps take that bridge away from like that LinkedIn separation. But yeah, like if you just come to someone asking for a favor, they’re going to have their wall up, right? I mean, a little bit if someone you haven’t spoken to in three, five years that, you know, you only know through LinkedIn and they never reach out to you any for anything, except, Hey, you know, want that job, I see this job posting, like you’re going to have your wall up too. So it’s more just trying to take that away by like what you’re doing, engaging, even just little comments here and there, awesome to see you’re crushing it, you know, just like words of encouragement. What, what harm does it do to send someone, you know, a congrats or something positive, right? If anything, they read it and it helps like puts a smile on their face or makes their day. And then they’re like, Oh, got a nice message from Manny. That’s nice. Like associate happy thoughts with Manny. So.

Manuel: That’s awesome. So outside of kind of the things that we’ve talked about, you know, we mentioned, you know, you going through kind of moving up, is there anything any other kind of advice that you could think of? So sounds like outside of going from once, you know, you’ve worked at the two main cybersecurity companies internally, you know, kind of interviewing, is there anything that you would say, hey, from an interview standpoint, a salary negotiations, you know, things of that nature, is there anything that you can think of that like, Hey, this is something I learned, you know, back then that I think would be beneficial or, you know, insightful.

Cynthia: Yeah. I guess I have a few. So one of them is finding mentors. As soon as you get to a new job, just trying to find, you know, who are the top reps, who are the top sales reps and why, and then reaching out to them, right? Because a mentorship doesn’t mean, you know, hey, can we can you be my mentor and then nothing else, right? You kind of have to ask for their time. It is a time commitment, right? Because they’re going to be now focusing energy on you. So it is, I didn’t realize you have to formally ask someone to be your mentor. And then they have to accept, right? Or else, you know, it’s not really a mentorship. So I would say always, I always recommend, you know, find someone that could be would agree to be your mentor and maybe give them even a little like a prep call, right? Of like, Hey, here are a few things I noticed you’re doing that I would love to learn from you. Can you commit to a monthly call or by weekly? I mean, whatever that is, that way it’s a clear understanding of like what your goals are, and what’s the time commitment that they are going to be required to, you know, adhere to, right? So and then see if they say yes. I mean, maybe they say, Hey, I don’t I don’t have the time, but then you can find someone else and that’s that’s fine. But most times I feel like people do respect it and are open to being a mentor because they learn from the experience as well. So I would say that’s one of the first things to do because you can really just learn so much from f