It might sound surprising, but we invited our friends Chris Pfaff from PHRT Training and Patrick Durham from Stached Training - experts in staff training - to talk about a possible new DOT category just for batteries.

Website: StacheD Training

YouTube: @stacheDTraining

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ObexionFR

ObexionFR is a mobile solution for first responders dealing with lithium battery fires, created by former FDNY Hazmat experts. It uses advanced science to neutralize fires by addressing heat, oxygen, and fuel, quickly containing and extinguishing them while keeping toxic gas levels safe. The process cools the battery, isolates oxygen, and prevents further ignition, providing a reliable tool for challenging battery fire incidents. Check it out.

908 Devices

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FSS

Fire Suppression Solutions, based out of Slinger, Wisconsin is the U.S. master distributer for multiple game-changing solutions that help protect communities, businesses, and individuals. Their partnership with LifeSafe Technologies has delivered TRF (Thermal Runaway Fluid), a product that has proved to extinguish Lithium-ion battery fires. Yes, it's a bold claim, but they have the testing to back it up. To learn more about this and their other lifesaving products, visit Fire Suppression Solutions.   UL for class A and B fires, BSI for 10 categories including lithium-ion batteries

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Episode Overview

The crew returns with a groundbreaking conversation proposing a new DOT classification: Class 10. This episode features special guests Patrick Durham of StasheD Training and Chris Pfaff of Hazmat and Rescue as they explore the emerging dangers posed by lithium-ion and other high-capacity batteries, particularly during transport. From toxic off-gassing to trailer explosions, this episode makes a compelling case for updating hazmat regulations to reflect modern battery risks.

Segment Breakdown & Timestamps

00:00 – Kicking Off

Celebrating the end of the DOT placard series and introducing today’s guests and topic.

01:26 – Meet the Experts

• Patrick Durham: Mechanical engineer, firefighter, and battery safety consultant.
• Chris Pfaff: Firefighter and founder of HazmatAndRescue.com.

02:39 – The Birth of DOT Class 10

Why traditional classes (like 9) don’t sufficiently cover lithium-ion battery hazards.

03:55 – Why Lithium-Ion Doesn’t Fit

A chemistry breakdown on why lithium-ion batteries can’t be accurately categorized under Class 9 or corrosives.

06:01 – The Placard Problem

How Class 9 labeling falls short in providing useful info to responders.

07:20 – Three Core Hazards of Batteries

• Fire hazard
• Toxic off-gassing
• Explosion risk in enclosed spaces

08:50 – Unveiling the Class 10 Placard

Design logic: Red for fire, white/orange for toxic and explosive hazards.

11:50 – Applicability & Chemistries

Addressing the scope: Not just lithium-ion, but other battery types like sodium-ion and nickel-based chemistries.

15:29 – Changing the System: The Political Challenge

Why lobbying Congress may be necessary and how this change can’t happen inside the DOT alone.

16:57 – Conference Push & Industry Buy-in

How awareness campaigns and conference talks are creating momentum.

18:02 – The Real Risk: Damaged, Defective, Recalled (DDR) Batteries

Why DDR batteries are more dangerous than new ones and how they’re often mishandled.

20:24 – Future Class 10 Divisions (10.1 and 10.2?)

Speculating on ways to distinguish between new and end-of-life batteries in regulations.

22:49 – How You Can Help

Call for connections: policymakers, union leaders, industry contacts to support legislative efforts.

23:00 – Transport Ironies & Gaps

Why intact EVs are exempt from transport rules while loose cells aren’t—even in the same vehicle.

26:44 – Evolution of Hazmat Response Tools

Why the ERG gets updated and how this effort fits that legacy of adaptation.

28:14 – Wrap-up & Call to Action

Final reflections and ways listeners can get involved.

Resources & References

• Patrick Durham – StasheD Training
• Website: www.stashedtraining.com
• YouTube Channel: Stashed Training
• Email: pat@stashedtraining.com
• Chris Pfaff – Hazmat and Rescue
• Website: hazmatandrescue.com
• Fire Engineering Article – Co-authored feature on the DOT Class 10 placard concept.

Guest Information

• Patrick Durham
• Mechanical Engineer, Battery Safety Consultant, and Fire Captain.
• Leads training and consulting on EV and energy storage systems.
• Chris Pfaff
• Hazmat Instructor and Founder of HazmatAndRescue.com.
• Known for short training videos ("Hazmat Minutes") and responder education.