In a world where Amy Fritz thought she knew the ins and outs of the way she thought a faith-based business such as the Lampo Group or Ramsey Solutions should work, she found herself plunged into a bewildering labyrinth of toxicity. The air was heavy with unspoken tensions, and the invisible shackles around her tightened every day, but just when Amy thought she had reached her breaking point, an unexpected twist emerged, shattering her reality and offering a glimmer of hope. What did Amy discover that could potentially change the course of her life and view of work? Stay tuned, for the answers lie in the depths of her courageous journey.

My special guest is Amy Fritz

Amy Fritz features as our guest on today's episode. Navigating the tricky waters of toxic workplace environments with grace, empathy, and a deep personal understanding, Amy is a force to be reckoned with. Drawing from her husband and friends' encounters with such situations, Amy breaks down the complex nuances of spiritual abuse and its consequent fallout. Renowned as the host of the 'Untangled Faith Podcast', Amy uses her platform to provide insightful content that resonates with those struggling in similar scenarios. Her straightforward yet empathetic approach positions her as a trusted source of advice and inspiration in this critical discussion.

Don't be afraid to leave a toxic work environment. Your mental health and well-being are worth prioritizing. - Amy Fritz

In this episode, you will be able to:

• Find out how to turn a harmful workplace atmosphere into a supportive and conducive setting for excellent work.
• Gauge how giving voice to the voiceless can invigorate an organization's transparency and growth.
• Discern the link between passive participation in wrongdoings and becoming an endorser of the same.
• Deal with the fear and courage intertwined in confronting a corrosive work atmosphere.
• Be spurred to initiate a positive transformation within your organization by valuing hidden efforts and ground-level changes.

Transforming a Hostile Workplace

Establishing a positive and healthy workplace environment begins with acknowledging the existence of toxicity and hostility. Individuals must not shy away from uncomfortable truths and instead face them head-on. By publicly rejecting harmful behaviors and attitudes, employees and leaders alike can set the tone for a more supportive, respectful, and transparent workspace.

The resources mentioned in this episode are:

• Visit Untangled Faith Podcast: Go to the Untangled Faith podcast to hear more about Amy Fritz's experiences with toxic workplace environments and spiritual abuse.
• Check out Ramsey Solutions: Explore Ramsey Solutions, the organization that Amy mentioned in the podcast, to learn more about those that have been speaking out about the toxic workplace environment there.
• Read about the Caring Well Conference: Look up the Caring Well conference, hosted by the ERLC, and what Boz Tchvidjan had to say about it, and. how others found it to be image management.
• Educate yourself on toxic workplace environments: Take the time to research and educate yourself on the signs and effects of toxic workplace environments to better understand and support those who may be experiencing them.
• Support survivors of toxic workplace environments: If you know someone who has experienced a toxic workplace environment, offer them support and resources to help them navigate their situation and heal.
• Foster a culture of accountability: Encourage open dialogue and accountability within your own workplace or community to prevent and address toxic behaviors.
• Seek out trusted resources: Look for books, podcasts, or organizations that specialize in addressing toxic workplace environments
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Transparency is key. Let the light shine on toxic leaders and hold them accountable for their actions. - Amy Fritz

The key moments in this episode are:

00:00:02 - Introduction,

00:01:25 - Importance of Knowing,

00:05:22 - Complicated Feelings,

00:07:01 - Collusion and Complicity,

00:10:41 - Perspectives on Collusion,

00:12:57 - Canary in the Coal Mine,

00:14:40 - The Importance of Speaking Truth,

00:15:49 - The Power of Prophetic Voices,

00:16:30 - Recognizing Our Complicity,

00:19:22 - Why We Should Want to Know,

00:21:33 - Navigating Complicated Situations,

00:28:42 - "Importance of Financial Transparency",

00:32:46 - "The Role of Whistleblowers",

00:36:14 - "Shifting Empathy Towards Survivors and Whistleblowers",

00:39:39 - "Personal Experience with Whistleblowing",

00:41:22 - "Dealing with Conflicting Information",

00:42:41 - Power Dynamics and Giving Power Away,

00:43:17 - Influence and Trust,

00:44:20 - He Said, She Said and Evidence,

00:45:06 - Power and Patriarchy,

00:46:54 - Speaking Out and Hope,

When we know better, we do better. - Lori Adams-Brown

Timestamped summary of this episode:

00:00:02 - Introduction,

Lori Adams-Brown introduces the podcast episode and explains that it is a recorded conversation with Amy Fritz, host of the Untangled Faith Podcast. They discuss toxic workplace environments and the importance of knowing about harmful situations.

00:01:25 - Importance of Knowing,

Amy Fritz explains why it is important to know about toxic workplace environments. She emphasizes the need to have information to make informed decisions and take appropriate action.

00:05:22 - Complicated Feelings,

Lori Adams-Brown and Amy Fritz discuss the complicated feelings people may have when they learn that something or someone they like or benefit from has caused harm. They acknowledge that it can be difficult to process and decide how to respond.

00:07:01 - Collusion and Complicity,

The conversation explores the concept of collusion and complicity when someone partners with or endorses a person or organization that has been abusive or toxic. They discuss the complexities of these situations and the need for further understanding and questioning.

00:10:41 - Perspectives on Collusion,

Amy Fritz shares her perspective on seeing individuals collaborate or work with toxic leaders. She mentions the importance of considering different factors, such as behind-the-scenes advocacy or the unintended message of endorsement.

00:12:57 - Canary in the Coal Mine,

Lori Adams-Brown and Amy Fritz discuss the role of being a "canary in the coal mine" and how someone's presence or departure can send a message about the

00:14:40 - The Importance of Speaking Truth,

The guest shares a story about someone who spoke truth to a conference audience and emphasized the need for introspection before hosting conferences. She highlights the importance of using influence and power wisely and not squandering opportunities to make a meaningful impact.

00:15:49 - The Power of Prophetic Voices,

The guest discusses the importance of prophetic voices who call out injustices and bring attention to ongoing issues. She praises those who use their influence to speak up, even at the risk of not being invited back. She acknowledges the complexities of certain individuals, like Rachel Dunn Hollander, who can be both helpful and hurtful.

00:16:30 - Recognizing Our Complicity,

The guest acknowledges that everyone is complicit to some extent and shares her personal struggles to maintain integrity in her faith-based spaces. She encourages listeners to strive for high standards and not be complicit in actions that harm others, even if they are unaware of the specific issues at hand.

00:19:22 - Why We Should Want to Know,

The guest highlights the importance of seeking truth and being willing to hear uncomfortable information, regardless of religious beliefs or lack thereof. She emphasizes that acknowledging our imperfections and being open to learning and growth is part of our integrity and faith.

00:21:33 - Navigating Complicated Situations,

The guest recognizes the challenges faced by individuals who may be financially dependent or deeply connected to problematic organizations. She distinguishes between those who may

00:28:42 - "Importance of Financial Transparency",

The hosts discuss the importance of financial transparency in organizations, particularly in nonprofits and churches. They mention the lack of reporting requirements for some organizations and emphasize the need for transparency to ensure funds are being used for their intended purposes.

00:32:46 - "The Role of Whistleblowers",

The hosts highlight the importance of whistleblowers in exposing toxic leaders and organizations. They mention that women often serve as whistleblowers and encourage listeners to listen to their stories and believe them, as history has shown that whistleblowers are often telling the truth.

00:36:14 - "Shifting Empathy Towards Survivors and Whistleblowers",

The hosts discuss the need to shift empathy towards survivors and whistleblowers instead of toxic leaders. They encourage listeners to have brave conversations, listen to survivors' stories without expecting anything in return, and offer statements of belief and support.

00:39:39 - "Personal Experience with Whistleblowing",

The hosts share their personal experiences with whistleblowing and receiving information about misconduct. They emphasize the importance of integrity and being willing to listen to difficult information, even if it challenges existing relationships or beliefs.

00:41:22 - "Dealing with Conflicting Information",

The hosts discuss the challenges of processing conflicting information and making decisions based on what is true. They emphasize the importance of seeking guidance from trusted individuals outside of the situation and maintaining integrity in handling sensitive information.

00:42:41 - Power Dynamics and Giving Power Away,

The guest emphasizes her belief in giving power away and discusses the importance of not enabling someone addicted to power. They also touch on the power dynamics between Dave Ramsey and the guest's organization.

00:43:17 - Influence and Trust,

The guest talks about how people often give automatic trust and influence to those with power and influence. She also highlights the challenge of being believed when speaking out against a powerful individual.

00:44:20 - He Said, She Said and Evidence,

The guest explains why the "he said, she said" approach is troubling and emphasizes the importance of looking at tangible evidence such as depositions, audio recordings, and transcripts.

00:45:06 - Power and Patriarchy,

The guest discusses the dynamics of power and how it can be abused, especially under patriarchy. She believes that good leadership is based on integrity and character, and toxic individuals will eventually face consequences.

00:46:54 - Speaking Out and Hope,

The guest explains her motivation for speaking out about the harm caused by powerful individuals. She believes that speaking out is a sign of hope and a desire for justice and restoration. Both guests express their hope for a future where they don't have to talk about these issues anymore.