In New Zealand's beer scene, there are now bonafide rock stars.

Two fo these are Jos Ruffell from Garage Project and Mike Neilson of Panhead.

Joining us at The Malthouse, Jos & Pete talk about the sacrifices they made to start their respective businesses and the different paths they chose as they tried to figure out how to keep growing without going bankrupt.

Mike explains why he made the choice to sell to Lion, and whether there are any regrets, while Jos puts forward his choice to remain independent and why he's turned down more buyout offers than he can remember.