While the land is ruled by nations and super nations, the ocean is subject to the tragedy of the commons. What if the ocean turned into a nation of its own—the largest nation in the world?

In the tenth episode of the podcast Ocean Wants, speculative writer Ingo Niermann, most recently of the book Mare Amoris, is talking to Markus Reymann, director of TBA21-Academy and its Ocean Space in Venice. We speak at his office in Madrid.

— Ocean Wants, Institut Art Gender Nature dertank.ch and TBA21–Academy, ocean-archive.org